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zorg
Turbo Slant 6
Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 854
Location: Bremerton, WA
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Post subject:
stiff shifting 833
(Thu Jun 21, 2012 11:07 pm)
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Soooo I recently rebuilt the 833od box in my Dart. Bearings, synchros, gaskets, etc. Everything looked great, went together well. Probably put ~500 miles on it, without a hick-up. ...Now I'm having an intermittent problem with not being able to shift into 1st and 2nd. Shifter feels tight, and occasionally refuses to go in at all. Impossible to downshift into 2nd, unless I'm barely rolling. Also, when it's acting up, and is in 1st or 2nd, it sings, almost like reverse does... 3-4 seem perfectly normal, on the other hand.
My first thought was linkage related... I've had the shifter mechanism apart and lubed it all up maybe a year and a half ago? Never had a problem with it, merely preventative maintenance. Everything else looked okay? Clutch is on it's way out, for what it's worth...
I'm stumped, and in a time crunch to boot. Collective ideas are better than my brain working solo, so thanks guys!_________________  |
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zorg
Turbo Slant 6
Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 854
Location: Bremerton, WA
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Post subject:
(Thu Jun 21, 2012 11:09 pm)
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And to hijack my own post...
I know I've read it somewhere before, but can't seem to find it right now. Slant vs. 318 clutch, same size or no? (both sporting 833s, naturally)_________________ |
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Joshua Skinner
Supercharged
Joined: 27 Jan 2005
Posts: 6479
Location: Portland, Oregon
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Post subject:
(Thu Jun 21, 2012 11:37 pm)
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| 318 clutch is larger. Make sure the shift linkage is adjusted properly. If it's not you'll have trouble moving between the 1-2 and 3-4 gates. If the shifting is considerably worse cold then the lube might be too thick. What did you use for lube? If the clutch is dragging it will be toughest to shift into reverse. Does it make noise shifting into reverse?
_________________
Joshua Skinner
car nut, telecom tech, tool using mammal
'72 Dart Swinger
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zorg
Turbo Slant 6
Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 854
Location: Bremerton, WA
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Post subject:
(Fri Jun 22, 2012 7:57 am)
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| Joshua Skinner wrote: | | 318 clutch is larger. |
Rats, that's what I was afraid of.
| Quote: | | Make sure the shift linkage is adjusted properly. If it's not you'll have trouble moving between the 1-2 and 3-4 gates. |
Linkage adjustment is okay, difficulty is strictly in the 1-2 gate.
| Quote: | | If the shifting is considerably worse cold then the lube might be too thick. What did you use for lube? |
Nope, worked fine when I left the house yesterday, and started acting up halfway across town. Pretty sure I used 75w90 Valvoline synthetic.
| Quote: | | If the clutch is dragging it will be toughest to shift into reverse. Does it make noise shifting into reverse? |
Honestly, I don't remember..._________________ |
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Rug_Trucker
Supercharged
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Posts: 2594
Location: Pertneer Nashville TN
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Post subject:
(Fri Jun 22, 2012 8:27 am)
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.._________________ '72 Duster 198 stock cam, 3:23's Hookers
'74Fart Dart 
'79 Maxivan 360 Offy Qjet Comp RV cam
93 D350 160HP Cummins Auto  Dually Clubcab
93 Corolla |
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Joshua Skinner
Supercharged
Joined: 27 Jan 2005
Posts: 6479
Location: Portland, Oregon
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Post subject:
(Fri Jun 22, 2012 10:16 am)
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| GL-5 gear oils are too slippery for the synchronizers to work well. If you want synthetic use a GL-4 like Redline MT-90. The noise worries me though.
_________________
Joshua Skinner
car nut, telecom tech, tool using mammal
'72 Dart Swinger
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kesteb
Board Sponsor
Joined: 06 Nov 2002
Posts: 1530
Location: Everett, WA
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Post subject:
(Fri Jun 22, 2012 4:38 pm)
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What do you mean by "tight"? In my experience the A833 always has a slightly "heavy" feel when shifting from 1 to 2. How did you adjust the linkage?
I thought the 833od took automatic transmission fluid.
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zorg
Turbo Slant 6
Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 854
Location: Bremerton, WA
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Post subject:
(Fri Jun 22, 2012 6:20 pm)
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| kesteb wrote: | | What do you mean by "tight"? |
"Tight" like it almost won't go into gear. Sometimes I have to row it a couple times, before it will finally go all the way forward into first.
| Quote: | | How did you adjust the linkage? |
Per the directions in the FSM.
| Quote: | | I thought the 833od took automatic transmission fluid. |
I have heard that argued both ways._________________ |
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Rug_Trucker
Supercharged
Joined: 23 Feb 2005
Posts: 2594
Location: Pertneer Nashville TN
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Post subject:
(Fri Jun 22, 2012 8:11 pm)
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Out of habit on a manual I go to 2nd before 1st or reverse to stop the gears from turning.
Sox and Martin ran a Borg Warner VS an 833. Shifted easier!
Try the clutch adjustment.
Dexron was the factory fill on the 833 . I think I put Mobil1 in my 833OD. I hope to try it in the next few months._________________ '72 Duster 198 stock cam, 3:23's Hookers
'74Fart Dart
'79 Maxivan 360 Offy Qjet Comp RV cam
93 D350 160HP Cummins Auto Dually Clubcab
93 Corolla |
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zorg
Turbo Slant 6
Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 854
Location: Bremerton, WA
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Post subject:
(Fri Jun 22, 2012 9:38 pm)
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| Rug_Trucker wrote: | | Try the clutch adjustment. |
Just did that, too.
| Joshua Skinner wrote: | | The noise worries me though. |
Me too! So if I magically have the time to drop the trans and open it up, what kind of thing should I be looking for?_________________ |
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rlklaus
EFI Slant 6
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 321
Location: Portland, Oregon
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Post subject:
(Sat Jun 23, 2012 8:06 am)
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I have an 87 Maxi with an A-833, it has ATF in the box.
In addition. Back in my younger days, I had a Challenger Convert, with a 340 4 speed. Took it in for service, and the grease jockey, dumped the trans, and refilled it with 90W. Went to drive the car away and could not shift to 2nd. Returned to the Shell station, and after a short disscusion between the shop owner, and the "Service Technician", they put the Challenger back on the rack, drained the 90W, and refilled with ATF. Problem solved.
Might not be in your case, but worth a try, before tearing things apart.
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66 Valiant, 225.
84 Van, 225.
71 Maxi-Van, 318
60 Valiant wagon, 225
87 Maxi-Van, 318 4spd
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Mroldfart2u
EFI Slant 6
Joined: 02 Feb 2011
Posts: 495
Location: Amarillo, Tx USA
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Post subject:
(Sat Jun 23, 2012 11:22 am)
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And to think I thought the ATF in a manual gear box was a "new" thing....  _________________ MRO....
Cheap, Fast, Reliable.... Pick 2...
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slantzilla
Board Sponsor & Moderator
Joined: 17 Oct 2002
Posts: 9418
Location: Park Forest, Illinoisy
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Post subject:
(Sat Jun 23, 2012 2:21 pm)
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| Rug_Trucker wrote: |
Sox and Martin ran a Borg Warner VS an 833. Shifted easier!
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Someone fed you some bad information.
S&M cars always ran slick shifted 833's until they switched over to Lencos.
A Borg Warner would not have lasted 2 passes behind a Hemi.
Even the Chebby guys ran either an 833 or a Toploader Ford. 
For the hard shifting try this:
Loosen the side cover bolts just enough that the cover will slide around a little.
Shift the trans into 1-2 a few times to see if it loosens up. Make sure reverse shifts freely as well.
Tighten bolts.
_________________
Proud supporter of Mike Jeffrey Racing Engines since 1999.
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kesteb
Board Sponsor
Joined: 06 Nov 2002
Posts: 1530
Location: Everett, WA
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Post subject:
(Sat Jun 23, 2012 3:24 pm)
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| zorg wrote: | | kesteb wrote: | | What do you mean by "tight"? |
"Tight" like it almost won't go into gear. Sometimes I have to row it a couple times, before it will finally go all the way forward into first. |
Is this at a roll or stopped?
| zorg wrote: | | kesteb wrote: | | How did you adjust the linkage? |
Per the directions in the FSM. |
I am not familiar with those instructions, please elaborate.
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zorg
Turbo Slant 6
Joined: 21 Feb 2003
Posts: 854
Location: Bremerton, WA
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Post subject:
(Sat Jun 23, 2012 6:42 pm)
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Kesteb, It happens both when stopped and at a roll.
FSM shifter adjustment goes something like:
-Disconnect shifter rods from the transmission tabs.
-Put a 3/16" pin through the aligning holes in the arms on the shifter mechanism.
-Thread in or out the adjuster ends on the shifter rods, until they line up with the holes in the shift tabs on the transmission.
-Reconnect the shifter rods
-Don't forget to remove the aligning pin in the shifter mechanism...
Slantzilla, Thanks for the tip, I'll try that out.
My replacement clutch should be here Wed. so I can swap that out and maybe peek inside the trans case too. Here's to hoping I don't have to work Thursday, as I need the car to get to Oregon on Friday..._________________ |
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