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| Still Won't Start https://www.slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4737 |
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| Author: | bud L. [ Fri Jan 03, 2003 5:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | 4 stroke |
You have a 4 stroke engine. Yes, it's very possible that when the timing marks on the timing gear line up, and the timing marks on the outside of the engine line up you may very well be at TDC on the exhaust stroke. The crank makes two revolutions for every turn of the cam. I'd be inclined to remove the valve cover and make dead sure you're looking at the correct valves. Don't forget the valve pattern is EIEIEIIEIEIE. Follow the manifold runners to reinforce this idea. You have to find #1 TDC compression stroke! Don't assume anything. ReRead my post about turning the dist body against the normal rotation until the reluctor/pickup line up. Clamp it down. Trial fit the cap on now, and make sure the rotor is pointing directly at a cap terminal. Make that #1. then install the other wires like I already described. Doc, I don't know how to post drawings. But maybe it would be heplful, to post some drawings graphically showing how when the cam gear timing marks line-up(say it's on the compression stroke), and the crank is rotated 360 degrees, the cam timing marks still line up, but the mark on the cam gear is 180 degrees from where it was previously, and the engine is on the exhaust stroke. I think this same problem was incurred and covered last year. |
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| Author: | Doctor Dodge [ Fri Jan 03, 2003 9:27 pm ] |
| Post subject: | This Slant will start... |
When the timing marks on the timing chain sprockets are lined-up, the cam is at TDC Exhaust. (99% of the time, I have seen some mis-punched top gears) I marked a white "X" on the photo below, where TDC Compression stroke would be on the top timing gear. You can "set" the cam in either position. Fact is that I degree my cams by taking valve and piston movement readings off of cylinder #6 not #1. (That's another topic) Swap the distributor around 180 degrees and fire this baby up. DD 
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| Author: | bud L. [ Sat Jan 04, 2003 10:27 am ] |
| Post subject: | ? |
A friend of mine 'degrees' every cylinder and averages them out. I guess I haven't got to that point yet. I am intrigued why you use #6, though. |
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| Author: | mszauner [ Sat Jan 04, 2003 12:36 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Almost Got It |
Well, I moved the balancer one turn to the mark again, then backed off 10 degrees. That made the distributor appear to be 180 off. I realigned the distributor with the rotor at number one again and manually timed it. I turned it over a few times and it ran for a couple seconds (with choke propped open. I figured it died because it was cold and the choke was propped open. I left it off since I still had the radiator off and didn't want to run it long without water. Then, I reinstalled the radiator, hoses, belts, etc. and tried to start it again.....it would not even pop again. I checked the positive end of the coil when the key was in start position and still only get about 6 or 7 volts. When going directly from the battery to the positive side of the coil, it will not pop. Even with ether it will not pop again. I pulled all the plugs and they were plenty wet. I burned off the gas, wiped them, regapped them and put them back. Still no start. I wonder if I am now maybe only a tooth off in one direction or another???? Am I getting too much gas???? Maybe I need to drain the tank and start with all fresh gas???? I have NEVER had such difficulty starting an engine in my life. I admit I am no expert but this is crazy. |
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| Author: | lance larson [ Sat Jan 04, 2003 8:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | won't start |
i have read most but not all of your replies , and have not heard you mention the excistance or quality of the spark you have . i know you have gas i'm assuming you have compression it sounds like the timing is close enough to run , i bet you don't have spark. |
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| Author: | mszauner [ Sun Jan 05, 2003 7:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | Plenty of Spark |
Actually, I used a spark tester and it shows plenty of spark. The tester I have said a Chrysler engine should require spark between 20-24 on the instrument's scale and I actually set it slightly higher than 24 and it sparks. Now, I did only check number 1...I'm assuming it would be the same for all plus I would at least get a pop if only one had enough spark??? I can check the rest of them. I also pumped out a quart jar of gas (disconnecting at the carb) and let it set overnight...100% gas. I think I am maybe a tooth off in one direction or the other for the distributor and perhaps I am getting too much gas. I still suspect timing since it won't pop on ether spray. How much would it cost to FEDEX the engine to one of you experts??? 
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| Author: | Doctor Dodge [ Sun Jan 05, 2003 7:55 am ] |
| Post subject: | You are really close.... |
You had it running, it will run.  I think you are "on track" with what needs to be done, fine tune the timing and get it running (keep it running) without flooding. FYI, wet plugs don't fire so if the plugs "wash-out" fast, something on the fuel side is not right. You are right about using a little choke to help keep a cold engine going but that will also flood it. Sounds like you have the static timing procedure down, put the damper mark 10 degrees BTDC compression and put a sparkplug in the end or #1 wire, ground it and rotate the distributor watching for the spark. I just did this to fire-off the 209 (170) in my dragcar, that engine fired-up so fast that I had to shut it off, pull the coil wire and crank it a few times to fill the oil filter. Plugged the coil back in, restarted and checked the timing with the light, it was at 8 degrees BTDC, I left it right where I had set it up. DD |
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| Author: | Rapid Robert [ Tue Jan 07, 2003 6:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
When the dots are in line on your timing gears that means #6 cylinder is at TDC ready to fire(why they do it this way I don't know) so put the #6 plug wire on the dist cap terminal where the rotor is & go 2-4-1-5-3 as the firing order is 153624. if your are all together then put your thumb on #1 plug hole & get it that way or if the valve cover is off then put a breaker bar on the crank pulley & as you turn it toward where the marks line up on the dampener if the valves aren't moving on #1 then #1 is on TDC if they are moving you are on TDC for #6 & you need to rotate the dampener on more turn. plus you gotta get a timing light even a cheapie to get you going. |
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| Author: | jedimaster [ Wed Jan 08, 2003 10:19 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
I had mega problems getting mine on and this is what I did to solve it. The way I got tdc compression was remove the valve cover, rotate engine til the timing mark lined up with the "0". Once its lined up try and wiggle the Number 1 rocker arms, if you can wiggle them its at tdc compression, if you can't wiggle them and you can wiggle Number 6 rocker arms, # 6 is at tdc comp. Alined the rotor accordingly and you should be off to the races.(btw I did all this without removing the timing cover). When I put the distrib in it idled at about 200 rpm's and I could accelerate it at all or it would die. I tried turning the distrib on its pivot all the way and now it got nothing, so I figured I was one tooth out, Removed it and turned it a tooth and couldn't get it to fire, moved it two teeth back the other way and bammo it fired up straight away, then I left it idleing and rotated the distrib on its pivot til it idled the best(fastest) and clamped it down, Drove it around, no ping no knock. I'll time it with a light when it gets warmer. good luck. |
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| Author: | '74 Sport [ Fri Mar 21, 2003 7:18 am ] |
| Post subject: | How critical is it for the index "dots" to line up |
We did a complete rebuild of my son's '74 225 /6. Having never even seen the inside of an engine before, it's been a learning experience for both of us. When we followed the timing set installation instructions from the rebuild kit, the "dots" were supposed to be facing each other and in line with the centers of both crank and cam shafts. Using a straight edge to check, the "dots" did not line up exactly. Nothing I could do would make them. They were about a half cam sprocket tooth off. Is this going to be critical when we need to set the timing, or can that little amount be made up in the distributor plate? Please bear with my ignorance. This is all new, yet exciting. I've been following this thread closely, in case we run into the same type problem. Fortunately, we were able to see the piston rod in its totally vertical position on compression, so we knew we were at TDC. |
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| Author: | mszauner [ Fri Mar 21, 2003 7:37 am ] |
| Post subject: | It Kinda runs now |
I did finally get it running and I think those comments and questions are on other threads. I went through several reman carbs and found one to kinda make it go. I still have to replace the accelerator pump but I am first rewiring it all because there are many bare wires shorting out. I received the harness in the mail and it is great. Hopefully this weekend that will be done and I will put in a new pump and then I can finally move on to the brakes and other delights. 
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| Author: | Dart270 [ Fri Mar 21, 2003 7:39 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Sport, Chances are you will be fine. I have never gotten ones to line up exactly and have not had problems. You might get a slight decrease in power/idle. The best way is to degree the cam. Lou |
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