Slant *        6        Forum
Home Home Home
The Place to Go for Slant Six Info!
Click here to help support the Slant Six Forum!
It is currently Wed Jun 03, 2026 7:42 am

All times are UTC-07:00




Post new topic  Reply to topic  [ 36 posts ]  Go to page Previous 1 2 3 Next
Author Message
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 9:26 am 
Offline
TBI Slant 6

Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:56 pm
Posts: 105
Location: Portland, Oregon
Car Model:
Quote:
If I remember correctly former user StephanieBrite77's 77 Volare 2 door super six and power brakes and steering was able to achieve 21-24 mpg highway once everything was tuned up and dialed in (she even cut a perfect light at Woodburn in that thing too...LOL).

Not bad for a $700 junkyard find...

-D.Idiot
Pretty cool! I picked up mine for just a little more than that.
Quote:
One of the main differences between the 318 and 225 BBDs is the orientation of the choke thermostat eyelet on the side of the choke butterfly valve. The 318 BBD has this eyelet oriented to be pulled straight up and down, while the 225 BBD has the eyelet oriented to move in a diagonal fore and aft motion. Using a 318 BBD on a slant six without address the difference in the choke linkage will lead to a choke that does not operate properly, and usually stays partially closed. A partially closed choke will lead to poor MPGs and leaving black soot on the driveway. User Fab64 came up with a very simple and elegant solution to using a 318 carb on a slant six. Do a search for fab64 and choke linkage to find threads with the pictures and description.

20 MPG is achievable, but you really have to get the motor and carb tuned well to do it (and drive to maximize MPG).
I must be mistaken then, I noticed when putting the 318 BBD on was that the choke linkage was noticably different than the BBD that came with the car. I did not think the airhorn had a thicker wall like described. I wonder if my choke thermostat needs replacing since I am using the proper linkage but experiencing the issues of a partially closed choke. Do these differ greatly between car and truck/vans models? Walker does seem like a better option than some ebay no-name brand

_________________
1978 4 door Dodge Aspen, Super Six


Top
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 11:07 am 
Offline
Turbo EFI
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2006 4:57 am
Posts: 1567
Location: Oslo, Norway
Car Model:
The description of the differences between 225 and 318 carbs start at page 26 in this manual, available in the FAQ in the forum's Engine section.
http://www.slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=33102

You'll also find info on electric chokes lower on that page.

Here are parts lists so you can see different combos of parts for trucks and cars: http://www.slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=43724

The differences between 225 and 318 BBDs, refer to cars with EGR and possibly other environmetal equipment. If your truck had neither, you may be able to fine-tune a 318 carb to suit your engine, even if the smaller venturies in the 225 carb is better for low and medium speed responsiveness. Throttle plate size is the same for all, the top part of the BBD also has a different choke plate.

Olaf.

_________________
Aspenized


Top
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 11:21 am 
Offline
Supercharged
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 13393
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model: 76 D100
The choke thermostat for cars is the same as the one for trucks and vans. However, both of the links you provided have problems.

The eBay link will work for a slant six, but it is missing the wire for the electric choke assist. On all factory Super Six installations the choke thermostat used both heat from the exhaust manifold as well as an electric current to open the choke. The eBay thermostat has had the wire for the electric choke assist removed. This will make the choke stay closed too long resulting in in poor economy and performance.

The O'Reilly link is for a v-8 application where the choke thermostat sits directly below the carburetor instead of behind the carb like the slant six.

Your best option for a new choke thermostat is to purchase one of the Carbs Only electric choke retrofit kits. These kits are a significant improvement over the old original design choke thermostats. The Carbs Only thermostats actually work and are infinitely adjustable. See HERE. You want kit 1232.

ave you read the Super Six conversion article? If not, you should. It is hosted right here on this very website, right HERE.


Top
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 11:24 am 
Offline
Supercharged
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 13393
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model: 76 D100
Can you post a clear picture of the passenger side of the carburetor and the choke thermostat with the air cleaner removed but the choke thermostat and choke pulloff linkage hooked up?


Top
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 1:12 pm 
Offline
TBI Slant 6

Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:56 pm
Posts: 105
Location: Portland, Oregon
Car Model:
Quote:
The description of the differences between 225 and 318 carbs start at page 26 in this manual, available in the FAQ in the forum's Engine section.
http://www.slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=33102

You'll also find info on electric chokes lower on that page.

Here are parts lists so you can see different combos of parts for trucks and cars: http://www.slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=43724

The differences between 225 and 318 BBDs, refer to cars with EGR and possibly other environmetal equipment. If your truck had neither, you may be able to fine-tune a 318 carb to suit your engine, even if the smaller venturies in the 225 carb is better for low and medium speed responsiveness. Throttle plate size is the same for all, the top part of the BBD also has a different choke plate.

Olaf.
I have already gotten familiar with that manual on the BBD and differences but I never looked into the electric choke option.

The parts lists has been helpful in letting me identify where the BBDs I have came from and also differences in rod and jet sizes.

My car has EGR but not an air pump or other Califonia smog items.
Quote:
The choke thermostat for cars is the same as the one for trucks and vans. However, both of the links you provided have problems.

The eBay link will work for a slant six, but it is missing the wire for the electric choke assist. On all factory Super Six installations the choke thermostat used both heat from the exhaust manifold as well as an electric current to open the choke. The eBay thermostat has had the wire for the electric choke assist removed. This will make the choke stay closed too long resulting in in poor economy and performance.

The O'Reilly link is for a v-8 application where the choke thermostat sits directly below the carburetor instead of behind the carb like the slant six.

Your best option for a new choke thermostat is to purchase one of the Carbs Only electric choke retrofit kits. These kits are a significant improvement over the old original design choke thermostats. The Carbs Only thermostats actually work and are infinitely adjustable. See HERE. You want kit 1232.

Have you read the Super Six conversion article? If not, you should. It is hosted right here on this very website, right HERE.
Wow, good to know. I have been reading into the electric retorfits today. NAPA seems to have an identical product. I only skimmed that article since I have a stock super six but I will give it a read through.

I can absolutely get those pictures up once I get home from work today

_________________
1978 4 door Dodge Aspen, Super Six


Top
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 2:00 pm 
Offline
3 Deuce Weber
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 08, 2011 7:07 pm
Posts: 79
Location: Montreal, QC
Car Model: 1977 B100 Van
Quote:
Wow, that's interesting and they also have the 1bbl version.
Don't want to hijack the thread but I'm wondering if anyone had experience with those NAPA units?

_________________
"Hey, I like that paint job you got. What they call that--sorta a cross between Piss Yellow and Puke Green, ain't it?" -- Bob Falfa


Top
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jun 10, 2013 2:12 pm 
Offline
TBI Slant 6

Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:56 pm
Posts: 105
Location: Portland, Oregon
Car Model:
The link below shows multiple types of this product, for holley and carter 1, 2, and even 4 barrel applications. biglsant6fan said in the original thread said he bought an identical one at napa 1 1/2 years before SlantSixDan posted about it, not much info on how it worked for him over that 1.5 year period though.

http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/Resul ... %2b2020004

_________________
1978 4 door Dodge Aspen, Super Six


Top
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 10:40 am 
Offline
TBI Slant 6

Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:56 pm
Posts: 105
Location: Portland, Oregon
Car Model:
Here are the pictures of the choke anc linkage, they are high res so I'll just link them. I ordered the electric Choke from NAPA, the closest one was in New Jersey! Be warned if wanting one from NAPA, you'll have to wait for it to ship.


Choke Linkage
Choke shown more clearly here.

Is there anything I can do for the time being to drive the car with out it eating gas? Can I remove the electric heat assist choke for a few days while making sure the car warms up in the morning?

_________________
1978 4 door Dodge Aspen, Super Six


Top
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:06 am 
Offline
Supercharged
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 13393
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model: 76 D100
Quote:
Here are the pictures of the choke anc linkage, they are high res so I'll just link them. I ordered the electric Choke from NAPA, the closest one was in New Jersey! Be warned if wanting one from NAPA, you'll have to wait for it to ship.


Choke Linkage
Choke shown more clearly here.
You have the correct 225 BBD choke thermostat that appears to be undamaged but you are using a 318 BBD. In the pictures you posted if you had a slant six BBD and the choke eyelet was in the position shown in the pictures, the choke flap would be fully open. Since you are running a 318 BBD when the 225 choke thermostat is in the "full open" position the choke plate on the carb is still 1/3-1/4 shut. This will lead to very poor fuel economy and performance.
Quote:
Is there anything I can do for the time being to drive the car with out it eating gas? Can I remove the electric heat assist choke for a few days while making sure the car warms up in the morning?
Yes. The fastest, cheapest, and easiest way to correct your choke linkage problem is to fabricate the adapter plate initially designed by board member Fab64. He adapted a 318 Holley 2280 to work on a 225 slant six. The piece you need to fabricate is the same as the piece he designed. Go to THIS THREAD and look at the pictures I posted in my post on that page. I show all the details you need to fabricate the piece YOU need to fix your choke.

DO NOT REMOVE THE ELECTRIC CHOKE ASSIST! Doing so will make your choke stay closed even longer and lead to even worse performance and economy. The electric assist helps the choke open faster, which is a good thing.


Top
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:43 am 
Offline
TBI Slant 6

Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:56 pm
Posts: 105
Location: Portland, Oregon
Car Model:
Quote:
You have the correct 225 BBD choke thermostat that appears to be undamaged but you are using a 318 BBD. In the pictures you posted if you had a slant six BBD and the choke eyelet was in the position shown in the pictures, the choke flap would be fully open. Since you are running a 318 BBD when the 225 choke thermostat is in the "full open" position the choke plate on the carb is still 1/3-1/4 shut. This will lead to very poor fuel economy and performance.
Damn! That is the carb that was on it when I bought the car too, just with a 318 throttle body I swapped in. These frankencarbs are starting to take up all my time! The carb I bought with a model # tag on it has a different choke linkage on it too so I was assuming that this one had the correct one. The model # 8135S, for a '77 318. I compared them side by side and did not notice a thinker walled air horn like described in the BBD manual. I'll post a picture of the linkages side by side for further clarification.

_________________
1978 4 door Dodge Aspen, Super Six


Top
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:35 pm 
Offline
Supercharged
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 13393
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model: 76 D100
Can you describe, exactly, or better yet post a picture, of what you are referring to as the "throttle body"? Are you talking about the bottom casting of the carb that houses the throttle blades?


Top
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 12:55 pm 
Offline
TBI Slant 6

Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:56 pm
Posts: 105
Location: Portland, Oregon
Car Model:
Quote:
Can you describe, exactly, or better yet post a picture, of what you are referring to as the "throttle body"? Are you talking about the bottom casting of the carb that houses the throttle blades?
Yes, this picture shows it on the right. I'm trying to use the terminology of the FSM. It refers to the carb as three pieces, going from top to bottom Air Horn, Main Body, Throttle Body.

_________________
1978 4 door Dodge Aspen, Super Six


Top
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 1:15 pm 
Offline
Supercharged
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 13393
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model: 76 D100
Got it.


Top
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 9:04 am 
Offline
TBI Slant 6

Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2013 6:56 pm
Posts: 105
Location: Portland, Oregon
Car Model:
[quote="Reed]but you are using a 318 BBD. In the pictures you posted if you had a slant six BBD and the choke eyelet was in the position shown in the pictures, the choke flap would be fully open.[/quote]

Reed, Are you 100% sure? I've been trying to look up pictures about what a 225 BBD choke linkage looks like. Here is a picture of 2 of my BBDs, labeled which is a 318 and which is a 225. Ignore the PCV valve connection as I had switched that part due to a leaky throttle shaft. I have identified the one as a 225 BBD for a 77 truck by matching part numbers on the jet and rods. Also it had the different lifter arm for the 225 mentioned in the BBD manual.

Also note, my car was cold when I snapped those pictures. Had not been run in days.

I just acquired another 225 BBD with an ID tag for a 77 truck, it has the same eyelet and linkage as the one labeled bbd in that picture. As well as all the other hallmarks of a 225 I mentioned.

I'm just trying to be sure, not trying to call you out! Maybe someone can post a picture of a 225 BBD linked up with a working choke.

_________________
1978 4 door Dodge Aspen, Super Six


Top
   
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 9:30 am 
Offline
Supercharged
User avatar

Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 13393
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model: 76 D100
Wait, upon closer inspection you DO have the correct 225 linkage piece on the carb. I see now that that picture must have been taken with the engine off and not fully warmed up.

If your main issue is MPG, I would start by verifying that the metering rods are adjusted properly.


Top
   
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic  Reply to topic  [ 36 posts ]  Go to page Previous 1 2 3 Next

All times are UTC-07:00


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 4 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited