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Slant 6 10" Performance Clutch Install 3-16-12
https://www.slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=48219		 Page 2 of 14
Author:  Greg Ondayko [ Mon Mar 26, 2012 8:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Cleaning / Shimming / Trimming 3-26-12
Here are the Next Step(s) in the Process:


Before Re- assembly of the clutch / PP / Flywheel I like to Clean the Bell Housing inside and out before the Reinstall:

Using The parts washer All the old greasy Gunk and clutch dust are removed from the stuff I am going to put back into the car:
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The stuff is clean Now!
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Even though I am not re-using the Old Flywheel on this project; I am cleaning it and Sending it to the machine shop for surfacing; I will stash it away and Possibly re-use it on another project Later
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For This pressure Plate Install I will have to shim the Clutch Fork Pivot Closer to the Flywheel / Engine - If you are using a stock type Pressure Plate this step is NOT Needed.
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I removed the Old Clutch Fork Pivot and Used it to layout some bits of Steel to make the spacer.
I marked the holes and Got the general outline for the Spacers.
Also the Stock Bolts That hold the Fork Pivot will be waaay to short so I will replace those too.
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Here are some shots of the Spacers I made - I was using some left over angle Iron and Made the spacers - No they are Not Billet, nor are they pretty but they will do the job.
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All 3 spacers are done; they measure about 1/2 Inch which should be just right for this setup - I can always unbolt the fork pivot and add or subtract the spacers to get it right.
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Next are some shots will all the spacers and Clutch fork pivot installed and bolted down.. Notice the longer bolts needed for this.
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All complete and A New Throwout bearing too.. I usually Toss In a New TO Bearing if I have the tranny out and I dont want to do the job again anytime soon.
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Now Lets take a look at that 10" Ford/Mazda Pressure Plate from McLeod.

I had some trouble with the clutch hitting / binding on the bolt hole material of the Pressure Plate Hat when I did this install on the dart back in 2006 - It is much easier to cut / grind these tabs before the install raher than after.
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The Pen points to the Black line where I am going to make the cuts;
This will happen on 6 of the mounting points.
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Tools I used to do this hack:
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Bits Removed - Not Much but enough to alleviate hassles later.
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Photos of the PP after Cutting the six Little tabs off:
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Pen Points to where the cuts were made:
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Next:
Test fitting the PP / Clutch / Flywheel / Clutch rod etc..


I have to Wait for the McLeod 464001 Flywheel to come in to do this.


Greg
Author:  Rick Covalt [ Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Flywheel
Quote:
I ordered the McLeod 464001 Flywheel and Once that comes in I will continue with the Install.
Greg, It would sure be nice if McLeod could get the center registry right to start with. I know it is not a huge deal, but it should not need to be taken to a machine shop out of the box. It cost us $40 and 2 days of waiting to get ours done.

Maybe this one will be correct? Let us know. great write up by the way!!

Rick
Author:  Junior [ Sat Mar 31, 2012 2:29 pm ]
Post subject: 
What makes the stock flywheel not a good choice for this mod?
Author:  Greg Ondayko [ Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Parts Update 4-13-12
@ Junior - Well I would not use the Stock Flywheel for 2 reasons -

#1 It's made from Powdered metal - Like cast Iron I suppose.. In a performance situation Things could fly apart and this can hurt or seriously hurt someone Not to mention damage you car quite a bit.. I have been there - Not fun.

#2 to use the Ford 10" PP the Bolt pattern for this on a slant Flywheel Has to be VERY close to the edge.. Near the ring Gear - The steel piece will do a better job with this small amount of material near the edge of the bolt holes.. and Not to mention you have to find a very competent machine shop to modify you stock PP to do this.. Could it be done .. yes I would not choose to do this.



Update... I ordered part #McLeod 464001 This time I used a local guy in town that was cutting my old flywheel - He is a McLeod Dealer - So a few weeks go by and I get the flywheel in.. I ask him to check the Center register - 'cause If it needs machined out to 2.165" (i am installing in a '68 up application) He could do this before I picked up the part.. He verified that the part had indeed come in with the '68 Up register... Great.

So I get home and notice the pP mounting patterns look funny...

It came with 2Sets of Mopar Borg& Beck PP Mounting holes drilled on it.

This certainly wont work.. Currently Waiting on a return to McLeod for a correction on this. :-( Will post updates when Info is available.

I did not have this problem 6 years ago with the part in the Dart - It was right the first time with the dual PP mounting pattern.

If you are interested in this flywheel maybe call McLeod Tech and Be sure to verify the 2 Patterns before they make yours.



Pics:

Here is the New McLeod Piece - Weighs 20#
Notice the "double" stock PP mounts..
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McLeod Piece Came in with the large Register:
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Stock Flywheel Has been Cut a few Times - Weighs In @ ~17#
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The Ford 10" PP does not line up anywhere on this McLeod Unit - It should - They screwed up:-(
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Shots of the Stock PP lining up on 2 Sets of Holes. - Dumb
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More to come when info is Available.


Greg
Author:  DusterIdiot [ Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:26 pm ]
Post subject:  17 lb flywheel?
Greg,

The 17# stock flywheel, what does the crankshaft side look like. Just curious since there are two flywheel styles depending on car vs. truck/ forged vs. cast crank applications. Just want to see if you have the standard car one with out the "ring/ridge" or the truck flywheel.

Good info, keep it coming.

-D.Idiot
Author:  Greg Ondayko [ Sun Apr 15, 2012 7:23 pm ]
Post subject: 
Here You Go DI...



These are shots of the backside of the Flywheel I pulled from the ca and had cut.... I am really not sure if it was originally from a cast engine or not.. THis car had a lockup 904 in it back on 2004 - Then I put the OD 833 in.. Nit sure where I got they flywheel.


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Greg
Author:  DusterIdiot [ Sun Apr 15, 2012 8:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Yep...
That's a car flywheel, I've found a couple on 1978 F-bodies as well...

The truck/late units have a thick ring on the back side...(which seems to help motivate fat a-bodies off the line due to the extra weight...which was probably needed to get a fat truck off the line when the engine got strangled by emissions requirements).

Thanks for sharing! 8)

-D.Idiot
Author:  Junior [ Mon Apr 16, 2012 1:12 pm ]
Post subject: 
So when everyone says if you take a manual transmission over 5000 rpm its gonna come apart, what actually fails? Flywheel or the pressure plate?
Author:  Joshie225 [ Mon Apr 16, 2012 2:46 pm ]
Post subject: 
Typically the pressure plate in the clutch cover fails first. Cast (iron and aluminum) flywheels are illegal under SCTA/BNI regulations for Bonneville and El Mirage. I ran my road race car over 6000 RPM and nothing failed, but it's risky.
Author:  DusterIdiot [ Mon Apr 16, 2012 5:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Yep...
I've done multiple 6000-6200 rpm clutch dumps on street tires and either the 9 1/4" stock clutch disc withers out or the kevlar disc takes on too much heat and just slides around....I haven't had a stock flywheel come apart yet, but I haven't pushed one to the "extreme" (gummy slicks, high rpm, puck clutch, lots of HP).

-D.Idiot
Author:  Rick Covalt [ Mon Apr 16, 2012 6:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Explosion
I think multiple 6000 RPM clutch dumps is the extreme on a stock set-up. I had done the same thing many ,many times . Mine exploded on street tires on the 1-2 shift. I am telling you, it ain't pretty. No way I would even consider using the stock stuff for high RPM shifts. I like walking too much. Do a search on Greg's 69 Dart and look at the pictures of his explosion. I had the twin explosion to his.

Rick
Author:  Greg Ondayko [ Mon Apr 23, 2012 10:42 am ]
Post subject:  4-23-12 Flywheel Update
The Local McLeod Dealer sent my Flywheel back to get the correct Bolt pattern drilled on it.


I reccommend to call McLeod Directly to Order your flywhyeel and Tell them to Order part # 464001 but to drill it with a stock Borg & Beck Pattern (McLeod PP Pattern #3 in their Catalog), & that you will be using McLeod # 360116 as your pressure plate - Ask them to drill this Pattern on your flywheel too.

I didnt have this problem in 2006 when I ordered # 464001 Directly but This time i Did - Hopefully I can get this all buttoned up in a week or 2.


Greg
Author:  Greg Ondayko [ Sat Jul 28, 2012 1:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Finally Done 7-28-12
Well After all the waiting for McLeod To get the Flywheel drilled correctly I got all the parts back and assembled in the car.

I clearly did not have all this trouble back in 2006 when Red Roberts ran the McLeod company.

Here is the Remaining install:

The flywheel is Back With 3 bolt Patterns on it Now.
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It now has the Pattern to mount the Ford 10" Pressure Plate... YAY
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I choose To use ARP Pressure Plate Bolts..
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These bolts come with Washers from ARP and They are listed for a Ford under ARP Part # 150-2201 - They would work with your stock Slant Flywheel too :-)
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Flywheel Installed - Used Some Red Locktite on the Threads.
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I will Use the Dinky Plastic Clutch alignment tool until I get the Press. Plate "Started" on the Flywheel.
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After I Get the bots started just enough to hold the PP down (finger tight)
I swap my clutch alignment tool to an old Input shaft.. I find this to be less hasslesome and the disc does not "slide" around and fall out of alignment with this tool.
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Once I get the disc in good smooth alignment with the old input shaft Then I start to crank the PP down in a criss-cross Pattern (much like the lugnut tightening sequence..) but just a few turns at a time at each bolt until the entire PP is bolted flush to the Flywheel and exerting full clamp load. (this process is much like putting a drum head on a Drum)
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All Tightened up Flush to flywheel.
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Remember the Clearance Notches I made HERE?
Here is Why I did that.. On the Dart the Clutch disc caught the Area of the PP near the bolt haed So A little clearance helps.
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When I first Test Fit the Bell Housing on I coundnt get it to sit flush against the block..

No Problem.. I shimmed the clutch fork pivot too close to the engine..

I removed one of the 3 Shims I made and clearance as good.
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I originally Had a stack of 3 spacers in there. Now just using 2. (this could vary with different TO beareings etc.. By the way Use a New stock TO bearing it will work if you are still using ma mopar's Linkage system.
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One of the Bolts needed a bit of grinding so the Bellhousing would sit flat against the front of the trans Face.
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The entire Set of Pics for this project may be found here:


Greg
Author:  slicknapier [ Sat Sep 08, 2012 9:29 am ]
Post subject: 
Greg thanks for the awesome write up with pics. I am putting a slant six with a 4 speed overdrive in my 48 Dodge Panel truck. The engine is going to to turbocharged, but nothing crazy. My question is, can I have the original flywheel redrilled without any issues? I'm just trying to save a few bucks, so I can get my hydraulic throwout bearing going as well. thanks
Author:  Greg Ondayko [ Sun Sep 09, 2012 8:30 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Greg thanks for the awesome write up with pics. I am putting a slant six with a 4 speed overdrive in my 48 Dodge Panel truck. The engine is going to to turbocharged, but nothing crazy. My question is, can I have the original flywheel redrilled without any issues? I'm just trying to save a few bucks, so I can get my hydraulic throwout bearing going as well. thanks

Hello, I have never tried to Put the Mazda/Ford 10" Pressure Plate Pattern on a Stock Slant Car Flywheel. I would imagine if you were using an 11" truck unit this would not e an issue.

You say with out Issues... Well this particular Pressure Plate Bolt pattern sits Very Far out on a stock Slant (car) flywheel.. the holes almost hit the Ring gear.. With The 2 Steel Flywheels (one in the Dart That Has had many High 14 Second Passes on it) this setup has never had any issues..

I do not know and Cannot speculate about the Stock Cast Flywheel holding up When the Holes are Drilled so near the outer edge of the Flywheel. I do know they hold up fine in steel.

If you continue this route, get the disc and Pressure Plate Part #'s Listed in the thread from Summit Racing and then take the Pressure Plate and Flywheel to a Very Competent & trustworthy Machinist to have the pattern drilled. It has to be centered spot on. I am not a machinist, Bu I know that if that part of the whole operation is messed up your project is shot.


Best of luck.

Greg
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