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| Nitrous VS Turbo https://www.slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=14098 |
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| Author: | Charrlie_S [ Sat Aug 20, 2005 5:22 am ] |
| Post subject: | Nitrous VS Turbo |
There have been a lot of posts asking questions about nitrous. There are a few of us running nitrous with some degree of success. There are also advocates of turbos (Tom). One thing that never seems to come up is the cost. Many want to go nitrous, because it is less expensive then a turbo. This is not totally true. It is a case of "pay me now, or pay me later". A turbo will generally cost more to install, then a nitrous system, but unless you break something, that's the end of it. With a nitrous system, you will need more then one tank, and you will need to get it refilled. This is what people forget. So you get to keep paying, and paying, and paying. Some tracks have nitrous available at $3-$4 per/lb. some don't. Some towns have a shop that will fill nitrous tanks, some don't (my town doesn't). I buy my nitrous in large tanks, then refill my 10 lb tanks (4 of them), myself. This saves a lot of money, and I don't have to worry about running out at a out of state, 3 day race. During the last 3-4 years, I have used about 8-9 hundred lbs of nitrous, at $3 p/lb, thats upwards of $2500. Even by using the large tanks (about $1 p/lb) thats still getting close to $1000. I am not complaing, just trying to enlighten anyone trying to deciede on which way to go. |
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| Author: | Dart270 [ Sat Aug 20, 2005 5:56 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Thanks, Charlie. That is very helpful info for the general public. Lou |
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| Author: | argentina-slantsixer [ Sat Aug 20, 2005 7:18 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Nitrous VS Turbo |
Quote: ... getting close to $1000. I am not complaing, just trying to enlighten anyone trying to deciede on which way to go...
Wow! I'm proud of being a mopar guy like you guys! if we were chevy guys we'd be talking about how a cofee can muffler gave us extra 90 hp and some 25% extra lbs/sqfeet torque...
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| Author: | emsvitil [ Sat Aug 20, 2005 1:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Nitrous VS Turbo |
Quote: Quote: ... getting close to $1000. I am not complaing, just trying to enlighten anyone trying to deciede on which way to go...
Wow! I'm proud of being a mopar guy like you guys! if we were chevy guys we'd be talking about how a cofee can muffler gave us extra 90 hp and some 25% extra lbs/sqfeet torque...What kind of coffee can do you use??????????? 
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| Author: | slantzilla [ Sat Aug 20, 2005 10:27 pm ] |
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Thanks Charlie! One other thing that has to be considered on any installation, be it joos, turbo, or blower, is the learning curve getting the combination right. I have watched the joos guys struggle and destroy a lot of parts, but that experience has helped me tremendously. I now have my car in the 12:30's @107mph, and have not so much as nicked a spark plug. Many thanks to Mike Jeffrey for his guidance there. It has not been so much him telling me what to do, but more importantly what NOT to do.  I know that Tom's learning curve was a tough row to hoe too. However, that car is a flat out rocket, and we have not seen anything close to it's full potential yet.
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| Author: | Rob Simmons [ Sun Aug 21, 2005 1:07 am ] |
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Thanks Charrlie, That is a very good point about cost now or later, and later, and later, ... And the point 'Zilla makes about the learning curve is true too. I hate the idea of learning about nitrous the hard way. That stuff blows things up! The turbo route seems like a great way to go. You just have to put forth a lot of the effort in the beginning by learning the EFI stuff, etc. There are more and more companies making EFI set ups for "Dummies" these days that can be adapted to the Slant 6. Charrlie has run both nitrous and turbo successfully and has been seen swapping from one to the other during events! What are your thoughts about your turbo set up Charrlie? Your turbo set up is much more basic without so much computer wizardry like Tom, right? |
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| Author: | Charrlie_S [ Sun Aug 21, 2005 5:50 am ] |
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I didn't consider the learning curve, because this is required with either nitrous or turbo, or blower. A lot of "newbees" to power adders, lean to nitrous, just because it is cheaper upfront. They don't think about the cost to keep "feeding" it, and this is never mentioned by the nitrous companies, or in magazine articles. Any type of power adder can "blow stuff up", if the "tune is not correct. When I did my turbo, back in 1979, it was "down and dirty". The first "good pass, after we got a carb to work, We blew the center out of #1 piston, at 20# boost. Had problems with colapsing ring lands, head gaskets, cracked skirts, etc. Back then, there was no such thing as electronic advance/retard boxes, fuel enrichment, etc. Also there was not much info on turbos available to the "backyard" mechanic. We did get it running decent at about 11-12 lbs of boost. When I put the turbo back on the engine in the Cuda, 2 years ago, I did some "upgrades", and did not get a chance to test anything, before going to Bristol. Had some problems, so removed it at the track, and put the nitrous system back on. I am working on my Vailant. Then I can race the Cuda, and "play" with the turbo Valiant, to get the bugs out. I will have the turbo running again. With the nitrous, on my original engine, I did blow a couple of head gaskets. After 2 years, took the engine apart and found some collapsed ring lands. Built a fresh motor, and due to some bad machine shop work, melted two pistons on the 5th pass. That is when I installed the turbo motor in the Cuda, for Bristol. I now have 2 years on that motor, (on nitrous, not turbo). The week before Wilkesborro, I stepped up to 150 shot, and I think I ate a piston. Haven't looked yet. |
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| Author: | Matadem [ Sun Aug 21, 2005 6:16 am ] |
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"The turbo route seems like a great way to go. You just have to put forth a lot of the effort in the beginning by learning the EFI stuff, etc." can also be done with a carb. 
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| Author: | slantzilla [ Sun Aug 21, 2005 6:44 am ] |
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Quote: Any type of power adder can "blow stuff up", if the "tune is not correct.
If you watch the race boardsl, you see people wasting pistons all the time without power adders too.
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| Author: | slantzilla [ Sun Aug 21, 2005 9:35 am ] |
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Just as a piece of basically useless trivia here, I have calculated that my 150 shots are worth 2.8 seconds of ET and 16 MPH. Every 12.3 second blast costs me $3.97 in joos, and I get 4 runs off a 10# bottle before consistency starts to suffer.
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| Author: | panic [ Sun Aug 21, 2005 10:32 am ] |
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| Author: | Charrlie_S [ Sun Aug 21, 2005 11:13 am ] |
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Quote: Easiest (nearly) bolt-on: a complete set-up from a hot-air carbureted Buick V6 (Riviera, GN, Regal). Use the whole thing including the carburetor, plumb the compressor discharge into the manifold, run a "U" from your exhaust dump into the turbine inlet, oil pressure from your sending switch port, make a hole above the oil level for drain into the pan.
That's not the hard part of a turbo install. The "tuneup" is the hard part. I used a modified Corvair system, which is an even closer match (Corvair 164 cubes, Vailant 170 cubes). http://www.1962to1965mopar.ornocar.com/schmid.html |
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| Author: | MrMopar [ Sun Aug 21, 2005 6:58 pm ] |
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Which one do you like driving better, turbo or nitrous? |
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| Author: | panic [ Sun Aug 21, 2005 7:36 pm ] |
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Of course, what was I thinking? 170/164 is much closer (103.7%) than 231/225 (102.7%). The tune-up? Put it on. Start it. Drive it. If I don't say anything, am I still wrong? |
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| Author: | Rob Simmons [ Sun Aug 21, 2005 11:14 pm ] |
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Dude,... Chill....... 
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