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 Post subject: Look what I found!
PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 6:27 am 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2005 5:09 pm
Posts: 2946
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Car Model: 1962 Plymouth Valiant Signet
http://members.cox.net/dakight/prodsheet.jpg

Where do I find the information to decode it?

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David Kight
'62 Valiant Signet, White
'98 Dodge Dakota
'06 Jeep Liberty

Growing older is unavoidable but growing up is strictly optional.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 11:10 am 
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david-
try looking here:
http://www.mymopar.com/tools.htm

-james

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 12:17 pm 
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Turbo EFI
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Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 7:20 pm
Posts: 1324
Location: Redwood City, CA
Car Model: 1962 Lancer 770
email Bill Watson, he's very good at decoding and did mine perfectly. nice find!

MJ


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 3:39 pm 
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My go-to guy and I pieced together the info below from your sheet. There's an inconsistency in the VIN, though. What is your car's complete VIN?

Line S: 1962 model year

Production Job Number 1443: This is a shop-specific sequence number
that was used to anticipate incoming cars. Since the broadcast sheet has seat spring marks on it, it came from the trim shop.

Shipping Order Number 0109 3116: The first part of that number on a '62
broadcast is the Scheduled Production Date, January 9, 1962. It was probably the 3,116th job scheduled for that day. The SO number will be on the fender tag and stamped into the radiator support and trunk lid opening lip on the driver's side.

PLT 2: Assembly Plant 2, Hamtramck.

Foreign Order No. or D/P Control No. 291485: This should be the
sequence number, i.e. the last six digits of the VIN.

Model 142: See http://maxwedge.com/years/1962plymouth.html. Again, IIRC,
this is the first three digits of the VIN. 1 = Valiant, 4 = Valiant Signet
200, 2 = 1962. Put that (142) together with the assembly plant (2) and
sequence number (291485) and you know the VIN: 1422291485.

Paint PP: Cherry Red body paint, PPG-Ditzler 71203

Style or Conv. Top 1: 1 means the body color and top color are the same (not a two-tone car).

Trim 585: Interior style (buckets, vinyl) and color. Code 585
is described in the '62 parts book interior section.

The rest are options. There are three ways of decoding these:

1. There is an 8 in box 328, which means the car has option 328; there can be no other digit in that position, it's either an 8 or it is blank, indicating a lack of option 328.

2. There is a 1 in box 34, indicating option 341. If there were a 3 in that
position, it would indicate option 343, and so on.

3. Boxes 54 and 55 contain a 12, indicating option 12. Confusing, I
know. But knowing that those boxes combined are for tires, you can find the correct option for this section.

I reposted my source's paste-up of the 1962 Plymouth and Valiant salesman's guide Here.
So, let's look up what options we can:

328 = Basic Radio Group
341 = Transmission (H'mm. Probably 3-speed stick shift. See below)
411 = Seat belts
533 = Axle ratio (not listed). Might've been SG or a lower gear ratio
54-55/12 = 6:50 x 13 whitewall tires
611 = Undercoating
652 = Not listed
677 = Not listed
687 = Not listed

The last three are similar to the X, Y and Z codes on fender tags from '69 to '80 or so. They will mean things like, "Sold Car", "Sales Bank", "Show
Finish", "Build to US/Canada/International Specs", "5 Gallons of Gas" or
whatever.

One more note on the transmission code 341. You will notice that there is no option checked for the engine, which means that this car had the standard 170 engine. If this car had the standard-equipment transmission, there would be nothing in box 34. One of two things come to mind: Either there were two standard-equipment transmissions available, or the standard transmission was a 3-speed with column shift and this car was to have a floor shift. Or a heavy-duty variant, or some other variant like that.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 6:47 pm 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2005 5:09 pm
Posts: 2946
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Car Model: 1962 Plymouth Valiant Signet
My VIN is 1422541443, the car has a 225, the engine block code is F225R. and here is a picture of the fender tag.

http://members.cox.net/dakight/Image1.jpg

It is a 3 speed, by the way and the color and other details are correct but the VIN does not match what you came up with. I suppose it's possible the back seat cusion was replaced from salvage or something... or got mixed up on the assembly line. I dunno. Thanks for the info! Way more than I was expecting.

One other note, the car has no radio, and no evidence that it ever had one (no antenna or fender hole) but it does have the remainder of the options in theat 328 group.

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David Kight
'62 Valiant Signet, White
'98 Dodge Dakota
'06 Jeep Liberty

Growing older is unavoidable but growing up is strictly optional.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 7:01 pm 
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Joined: Thu Oct 31, 2002 5:39 pm
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Location: North America
Car Model:
Yeah...even if the seat is original, the build sheet you find in it isn't necessarily for your car. They really weren't careful or methodical about it. Some cars left the factory with no build sheet, others left the factory with three or four of them—obviously not all of which belonged to that car, etc.

You can get a true and correct build record for your vehicle by sending $45 to DaimlerChrysler Historical; I can post the info if you like.

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Too many people who were born on third base actually believe they've hit a triple.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 7:07 pm 
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Supercharged

Joined: Thu May 12, 2005 11:50 pm
Posts: 6291
Location: So California
Car Model: 64 Plymouth Valiant
On my 64, the build sheet under the rear seat did match the build sheet tacked on behind the glove box.

I've pulled out the under the seat build sheet for reference, but left the one attached to the glove box............

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Ed
64 Valiant 225 / 904 / 42:1 manual steering / 9" drum brakes

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 7:31 pm 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2005 5:09 pm
Posts: 2946
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Car Model: 1962 Plymouth Valiant Signet
Quote:
You can get a true and correct build record for your vehicle by sending $45 to DaimlerChrysler Historical; I can post the info if you like.
Thanks for the offer, right now I've got a lot of better places to put $45.00. I still have to pay for the machine work on my block. Get the head reworked. Rebuild the trans, install the brakes, buy a cam, wheels, and tires. Maybe later I will be more interested.

I should say "more pressing places," not necessarily "better", but I'm sure you understand. :)

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David Kight
'62 Valiant Signet, White
'98 Dodge Dakota
'06 Jeep Liberty

Growing older is unavoidable but growing up is strictly optional.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 7:43 pm 
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Posts: 24803
Location: North America
Car Model:
Quote:
the car has a 225, the engine block code is F225R.
Not an original engine. A 1962 225 would be stamped S22 followed by a month and day (e.g. S22-8-17). The full engine displacement (e.g. "225") F225 suggests a 1970 engine.

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Too many people who were born on third base actually believe they've hit a triple.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 8:33 pm 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2005 5:09 pm
Posts: 2946
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Car Model: 1962 Plymouth Valiant Signet
That would explain the heat shroud and snorkel air cleaner on the carburetor. Maybe I don't need to look for a late model head after all. That would be a bonus. The one I'm having machined now is out of a 62 Lancer and the numbers on it match the pattern you just described though I don't remember exactly what they are.

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David Kight
'62 Valiant Signet, White
'98 Dodge Dakota
'06 Jeep Liberty

Growing older is unavoidable but growing up is strictly optional.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 8:19 am 
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3 Deuce Weber

Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2004 10:49 pm
Posts: 54
Car Model:
The production broadcast sheet is for that car - they both have the same shipping order - 0109 3116.

Production broadcast sheets were attached to items brought in from other plants (seats) or assembled on another line (instrument panels), larger items (carpets) and, during assembly, taped to the fenders (for axle, brake, etc. info). Thus the sheets were tucked into the seat springs, attached to the glove box, tucked under the carpet, etc.

The VIN - 1422 541443

1 - Plymouth Valiant
4 - Signet 200
2 - 1962 model year
2 - Hamtramck assembly plant
541443 - sequential production number - 41,443rd car off the line.

Hamtramck had two assembly lines -
B body - Dart & Polara - SPN started at 100001
A body - Valiant & Lancer - SPN started at 500001.

The bottom line of the tag is similar to the top of the sheet :

0109 3116 - Shipping Order Number where "0109" is the scheduled built date - January 09 (1962)

Model 142 -
1 - Plymouth Valiant
4 - Signet 200
2 - 2-door hardtop

Plant 2 - Hamtramck assembly plant

Trim 585 -
58 - Bucket seats, vinyl
5 - Red

Paint -
P - Roof colour - Valiant Red *
P - Body colour - Valiant Red *
1 - Style - single tone
P - Interior - Red
* - Plymouth called it "Cherry Red", Dodge was "Vermilion Red" and Chrysler "Festival Red". Only Imperial did not offer that shade.

Sales codes :
328 - Signet package (need further info)
341 - 3-speed manual, column shift
411 - Safety belts - 2 front
502 - 225-cid slant six (look very, very closely)
533 - 3.23:1 ratio
541/542 tires : 12 - 6.50x13", whitewall
611 - Undercoating with hood pad
652 - Sold car (dealer has buyer lined up for car)
677 & 687 - route codes - shipping info

For your data tag,
A = Accessory Package : 8 : 328 - Signet Package
C = Transmission : 1 : 341 - 3-speed manual, column shift
K = Interior items : 1 : 411 - Seat Belts
N = Engine 2 : 502 - 225-cid slant six
T = Vehicle Sales / Delivery : 2 : 652 - Sold car

The neatest thing about this car is the lack of anything in the "38" column or under the letter "G". This car was ordered with no heater.

The model year and sequential production number appear nowhere on either the production broadcast or the data tag. It would not appear on the tag until 1969.

Prior to 1969, the Shipping Order Number was the all important number prior to completion of the car. It appeared on the tag, sheet, car and the final build record. As the cars were finished, a worker would grab a VIN plate, stamp the car line and series onto it, record it and attach it to the car.

If you look closely at the VIN plate you will see the last eight digits are raised as well as nice and even. The first two digits are stamped, and not always in alignment.

The build record will have the Shipping Order Number, VIN, the date the car was shipped from the factory and to which dealer.

As for your engine "F225R"
F - 1970 model year
225 - 225-cid slant six
R - regular fuel.

Are there any other numbers or letters? There should be eight numbers in there that form the date the engine was assembled and the dailt sequence number.

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Bill
Vancouver, BC


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 11:20 am 
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Board Sponsor & Contributor

Joined: Thu Oct 31, 2002 5:39 pm
Posts: 24803
Location: North America
Car Model:
Quote:
Production broadcast sheets were attached to items brought in from other plants (seats) or assembled on another line (instrument panels), larger items (carpets) and, during assembly, taped to the fenders (for axle, brake, etc. info). Thus the sheets were tucked into the seat springs, attached to the glove box, tucked under the carpet, etc.
There is an interesting explanation for why it's (much) rarer to find a broadcast sheet in a Los Angeles-built car than in cars built in other plants. A former LA lineworker reports that the paper used for the broadcast sheets was not certified as complying with certain specific California fireproof-materials requirements, therefore legally couldn't be left in the car. Whether it's actually true or not would be very difficult to find out, but it's certainly plausible.
Quote:
Sales codes :
328 - Signet package (need further info)
You quite sure about that? The 1962 Plymouth and Valiant Salesman's Guide states that code 328 refers to BASIC RADIO GROUP (All models), which comprises:

• radio—push-button
• heater
• back-up lights
• variable speed windshield wipers
• windshield washers
• outside left mirror
Quote:
502 - 225-cid slant six (look very, very closely)
Good eye; I missed that!
Quote:
A = Accessory Package : 8 : 328 - Signet Package
See above
Quote:
The neatest thing about this car is the lack of anything in the "38" column or under the letter "G". This car was ordered with no heater.
But it was ordered with option pkg 328 which includes the heater.
Quote:
The model year and sequential production number appear nowhere on either the production broadcast or the data tag. It would not appear on the tag until 1969.
The model year is actually the very first thing on the broadcast sheet; the "S" in the "Line" box indicates this is a 1962-model vehicle. (R = 1961, T = 1963, V = 1964, A = 1965, B = 1966, C = 1967, etc.)
Quote:
Prior to 1969, the Shipping Order Number was the all important number prior to completion of the car. It appeared on the tag, sheet, car and the final build record. As the cars were finished, a worker would grab a VIN plate, stamp the car line and series onto it, record it and attach it to the car. If you look closely at the VIN plate you will see the last eight digits are raised as well as nice and even. The first two digits are stamped, and not always in alignment.
True. That RHD dieselised '61 Valiant that we were talking about some time back when it went across eBay has a new owner who's absolutely certain she's got a factory prototype "because the first two digits are stamped instead of raised, and they don't line up".

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Too many people who were born on third base actually believe they've hit a triple.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2006 4:36 am 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2005 5:09 pm
Posts: 2946
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Car Model: 1962 Plymouth Valiant Signet
Quote:
Quote:

Sales codes :
328 - Signet package (need further info)

You quite sure about that? The 1962 Plymouth and Valiant Salesman's Guide states that code 328 refers to BASIC RADIO GROUP (All models), which comprises:

• radio—push-button
• heater
• back-up lights
• variable speed windshield wipers
• windshield washers
• outside left mirror
The car does have a heater but it does not and apparently has never had a radio. It has the correct delete plate and there is no hole nor evidence of a hole in the fender where an antenna would have been mounted. Further, I think it is unlikely that a car sold in Oregon would have been sold without a heater. I bought the car from the original owner's grandson who inherited it from her a few years ago.

About the engine numbers:

I just scraped the accumulated grease away enough to see the "F225R", it was in the evening and I was working by flashlight. I'll look again when I get a chance and see if I can uncover the rest of the numbers.

I'm in the process of building a new motor, however, and it is original to a 62 Lancer. Should get the block back from the machine shop this week.

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David Kight
'62 Valiant Signet, White
'98 Dodge Dakota
'06 Jeep Liberty

Growing older is unavoidable but growing up is strictly optional.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2006 3:28 pm 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2005 5:09 pm
Posts: 2946
Location: Gilbert, Arizona
Car Model: 1962 Plymouth Valiant Signet
Quote:
As for your engine "F225R"
F - 1970 model year
225 - 225-cid slant six
R - regular fuel.

Are there any other numbers or letters? There should be eight numbers in there that form the date the engine was assembled and the dailt sequence number.
The complete number as far as I can tell is F225R 1118X followed by what looks to be a Maltese Cross

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David Kight
'62 Valiant Signet, White
'98 Dodge Dakota
'06 Jeep Liberty

Growing older is unavoidable but growing up is strictly optional.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2006 4:44 pm 
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Location: Silver Springs, Fl.
Car Model:
Quote:
Quote:
As for your engine "F225R"
F - 1970 model year
225 - 225-cid slant six
R - regular fuel.

Are there any other numbers or letters? There should be eight numbers in there that form the date the engine was assembled and the dailt sequence number.
The complete number as far as I can tell is F225R 1118X followed by what looks to be a Maltese Cross
The Maltese Cross means the crank is not standard size. The location of the undersize journals will be stamped on the machined surface of a counterweight. For a rod journal there will be a "R", for a main a "M" The "X" after the serial number, means all the mains and/or all the rods are .010 undersize. If you have a Maltese Cross without the "X" it means one or more main or rod journal is .001 undersize.

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Charrlie_S
65 Valiant 100 2dr post 170 turbo
66 Valiant Signet 170 nitrous
64 Valiant Signet
64 Valiant 4dr 170
64 Valiant 4dr 225


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