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| Timing Issues? https://www.slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=50562 |
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| Author: | Danarchy [ Thu Dec 13, 2012 7:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Timing Issues? |
1964 Dart GT 225/904 Engine completely rebuilt top to bottom and just put it in the car. The car ran Great before rebuild, just had a spun crank bearing(#5) and knocked. Have Fuel and fire, I am just not 100% confident in my timing.(re-installing the distributor) I set the #1 cylinder at TDC by cranking the engine until piston is up on #1(loose rockers on #1 & tight on #6), set the rotor to point at #1 plug wire and left the bolt to the block loose enough to move the distributor. Only things I have changed from stock are Double Row timing chain(Cloyes) and Romac Balancer. I feel like I am missing something easy! Any tips appreciated!-Dan |
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| Author: | DusterIdiot [ Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Are you? |
Running EI or points...Everything else should be stable...also what kind of coil are you running? -D.Idiot |
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| Author: | Danarchy [ Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:09 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Points. Stock coil(was on there when I bought the car), not sure of brand, but I get a strong spark. |
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| Author: | SpaceFrank [ Fri Dec 14, 2012 7:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
What's the problem? Is it running badly, or not running at all? If it's not firing up at all and you know you have spark, you might be 180 degrees off, i.e. you set up at the wrong TDC. The plugs would be sparking at the end of the exhaust stroke. I did this the last time I had my distributor out. |
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| Author: | Danarchy [ Fri Dec 14, 2012 8:58 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
180' out was my first thought, so I turned the engine and reset the distributor. still wouldn't start. I shot about a table spoon of oil in each cylinder before I started cranking the engine. I will keep trying to reset the timing (TDC) and distributor, because I think that is where my problem is. |
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| Author: | Reed [ Fri Dec 14, 2012 9:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
(1) make sure the valve lash is set on the loose side of the adjustment. If the valves are too tight you won't get compression. (2) Did you degree the cam? |
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| Author: | Danarchy [ Fri Dec 14, 2012 10:26 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
Quote: (1) make sure the valve lash is set on the loose side of the adjustment. If the valves are too tight you won't get compression.
I have good compression, and valves would be what I would say are somewhat loose.(not tight by any means)Quote: (2) Did you degree the cam?
No, I do not have the tools.  Timing chain gears lined up on marks.
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| Author: | Reed [ Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:28 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
If you are positive you have spark and fuel, then the only thing you can do is go back and verify that you have the #1 piston at TDC on the compression stroke when you are trying to time the motor. First, using a piston stop tool, verify that your timing mark still accurately shows TDC on #1. Then. pull the valve cover and rotate the crank over by hand clockwise. Watch the movement of the valves on cylinder #1. Keep rotating until the intake valve opens and shuts. After the intake valve shuts, rotate until your timing mark says TDC. Now install the distributor with the rotor pointed at the #1 plug tower on the distributor cap. Try starting it. If that still won't get the motor running, I would pull the timing cover off and degree the cam. If you can't degree the cam then verify that the dots are truly lined up. It is very easy to get the dots close but one tooth off. I have done that several times. 
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| Author: | Danarchy [ Fri Dec 14, 2012 12:50 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Thanks everyone, I am positive that I have spark & fuel (maybe too much fuel after cranking so much) The TDC is where I am not 100% sure, my piston stop tool is a wooden chop stick in an old busted out spark plug! (I made it myself!) I can feel the piston moving up and down. Turning the engine by hand is not as easy as it was before the rebuild (184K miles), I bump it close with the starter and then turn it by grabing the harmonic balancer. The car used to start within a few cranks from cold, and you could just about look at the key to start it when warm. |
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| Author: | Danarchy [ Sat Dec 15, 2012 12:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
New plugs, Plug wires, Dist. Cap & rotor, swapped coil with another used one I have. Still nothing.  I started off with the plugs,wires,cap&rotor that came out of the car before the rebuild, because I knew they worked. I have set and reset TDC so I feel more confident that I am not 180' off.I did get alittle back fire through the carb and almost a sound of combustion, like the engine wanted to fire??? I need help. Battery is charging right now. |
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| Author: | Danarchy [ Sat Dec 15, 2012 3:26 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Quote: After the intake valve shuts, rotate until your timing mark says TDC.
Reed- When you say "says TDC", do you mean that the "0" on the Harmonic Balancer lines up with the "0" on the timing tab?
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| Author: | Joshie225 [ Sat Dec 15, 2012 5:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Doesn't the factory service manual list the intake valve opening point and checking clearance to see if the cam/valve timing is correct? I'm away from my 1966 Dart and Coronet manual otherwise I'd look myself. |
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| Author: | Danarchy [ Sat Dec 15, 2012 7:12 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Quote: It is very easy to get the dots close but one tooth off. I have done that several times. I hope thats not the case, because that ROMAC balancer is a PITA to remove. (although it went on fairly easy?)
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| Author: | Reed [ Sat Dec 15, 2012 8:54 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
"Says TDC" means timing mark at 0 degrees. If you are getting backfires through the carb and the motor almost starts, you timing is close, but not close enough to let the motor start. Try retarding the timing slowly as you crank the engine. |
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| Author: | Groovin65 [ Sat Dec 15, 2012 9:45 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
I recently rebuilt top to bottom and had this issue too. First it was a fuel issue but then it was a tooth off. I would crank---nothing--- take it out, rotate 1 tooth and crank--- You get the picture....  Its worth a shot if you're getting everything else as I was
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