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Possible head gasket issue opinions greatly appreciated
https://www.slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=55526		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  1974duster kev [ Wed Jun 04, 2014 7:27 pm ]
Post subject:  Possible head gasket issue opinions greatly appreciated
Well I noticed some coolant sitting on the block the other day after a 1st through 4th gear pull thought it was a leaky freeze plug at first glance but upon further molesting the head seem to be wet around the head where the head gasket is which ran down onto the freeze plugs, the freeze plugs appear fine. I drove the car for a couple days without beating on it, no antifreeze on the block anymore so i'm assuming i'm pushing some water on boost only. My head gasket is a .100 thick hussey copper head gasket sprayed with hylomar when I assembled the engine a couple years ago. I shot the breeze with the famous Charlie about it and we are figuring since the cars runs fine and copper head gaskets are reusable (of course if it looks okay when I take it apart to just clean it well, respray it and put a tiny bit of RTV around my water passage holes). I have a few questions and would like your wonderful brains for some opinions.

1. I may attempt to re torque the head first see if that helps any thoughts?(the motor is ARP studded throughout)
2. I would love the idea of running a more standard crush style head gasket but what is the thickest they come because I use the .100 thick hunk of copper to bring my compression down to 8.6:1(wiesco/k1 combo, head is 53cc)
3. If I did switch to the thickest crush style gasket offered and increase my static compression to say 9.0:1 or even something higher 9.5:1 am I opening up a horrible ball of wax as far as fighting detonation on premium pump gas? (I run straight meth injection and am intercooled 14psi at the moment, cam 220@50 464lift 114lsa)

I would appreciate any feedback i'm considering all my options if i'm going to go through the hassle to take it apart and re spray the gasket I mine as well become aware of other head gasket options while i'm there.

P.S. noticed this while wiring up the line lock and 2 step was hoping to throw down some 1/4 times at the Valdosta georgia track towards the end of this month. ( Broke a u joint before I could make a clean pass 2 weeks ago)

Thanks,
Kev
Author:  Junior [ Wed Jun 04, 2014 10:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Possible head gasket issue opinions greatly appreciated
my response is from observation and not experience.

how sure are you that its coming from the head to block surface? are you sure its not coming from your manifold studs? also are you running a catch can? i wasnt for a while and under load my rad would spew all over the place.

1 pulling a valve cover is easier then pulling manifolds/head. worth a shot in my book.
2 no real idea. the felpro head gasket im running i believe is .039 compressed. im sure there are bigger but this is the only one i know of.
3 fwiw my room mate has a lancer evolution. (i know its not a mopar but it sure as hell is bad ass) they run a 9:0 compression ratio. he is pushing almost 30psi. granted the motor has vvt and all kinds of other goodies but the principle is the same. keep your afr and your timing under control and i dont think you would have a problem. especially with your two intercoolers.
Author:  Shaker223 [ Thu Jun 05, 2014 7:30 am ]
Post subject: 
I would lift the standard ARP head studs. After a day at the track I would be down a quart of coolant.

We did a group buy with ARP a few years back for studs with better material. They are about 16% stronger than the standard material and seem to be doing the trick.
Author:  CNC-Dude [ Thu Jun 05, 2014 10:16 am ]
Post subject: 
It's not uncommon to have to re-torque copper head gaskets a few times to get them to fully compress and crush, especially with one as thick as yours. So if you haven't done this, you might need to start with that to make sure it is completely compressed and not the problem.
Author:  1974duster kev [ Thu Jun 05, 2014 10:33 am ]
Post subject: 
Ive re torqued it once or twice in the past couple years but I plan on doing that before I take anything apart. I believe my arp studs say 80 or 85 ft lbs can I safely torque them higher to 90 or more? I believe i have the 200,000 psi ones can't remember if I had the 220,000 or studs or not I would have to find the box or receipt in my folder.

Those damn evo's I actually hang out at a car meet with a few of my close buddies ( 3 different evo's) they range from mild to wild but either way all 3 of them are running from 20 plus psi and Johns car is 9.5:1 so I may be tempted to let my compression go up if I end up unable to get this copper head gasket back under wraps. My rad is always dry only coolant i've ever seen was sitting on the block right under the front two freeze plugs but they had a trail of wetness above them leading to where the head and block meet. Not sure if my studs are leaking have not been able to verify that yet.

Hmm sounds about right Tom my rad went down a couple inches after a few days and the car usually gets floored eveytime I drive it. :twisted:

Thats true this is a huge hunk of copper. The block and head is not o ringed and I don't have the tools or time to do that up here at FSU now. The question is if i decided to switch to a non copper gasket soon what would you guys run I have no proof but I feel like that aussie head gasket would be better than a felpro. Other brands or ideas (specially related to thickness)

Thanks guys, still trying to chew on all of this

Kev
Author:  buick roadster [ Wed Aug 13, 2014 2:52 pm ]
Post subject: 
iv'e used copper head gaskets for years with no trouble.to seal them iv'e found 3 bond (black)is the only sealant that works(like forever!!)forget the spray on stuff-it doesn't go on thick enough and I press in small steel tubes into the water jacket holes(in the block)-old steel fuel pump line is good for this,to stand proud of the block(10mm) and gasket.when the head is lowered onto the block,these tubes then go into the head(not tightly)the sealant is then crushed around the tube(put sealant onto both sides of the gasket) ,not blocking the water jackets.use a lot of sealant and torque down while wet,and don't start for a few hours to allow the sealant to dry(next day is best).
Author:  Kidd [ Wed Aug 13, 2014 9:06 pm ]
Post subject: 
I run copper.....and had to retorque them (ARP) a few times.....have 13 runs on it now....and will re torque them the next time I run it and warm it up.Mine is a 12.25 :1 engine
Andrew/Kidd
Author:  Rick Covalt [ Sat Aug 16, 2014 1:59 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
found 3 bond (black)is the only sealant that works(like forever!!)
Is this just Silicone gasket maker?
Author:  DadTruck [ Tue Aug 19, 2014 7:15 pm ]
Post subject: 
ditto the question on the 3 Bond

is this the same stuff?

http://www.amazon.com/Three-Bond-Sealan ... B007TWXI1K
Author:  buick roadster [ Mon Sep 01, 2014 1:58 pm ]
Post subject: 
no-what you need is the 3 bond "black"(head gasket) silicone sealer.they are colour coded.check out the 3 bond web site and they have the part number.i get mine from e-bay.just cheched-3 bond black 1207B
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