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| How close are the timing marks. https://www.slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=55677 |
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| Author: | 1930 [ Tue Jun 24, 2014 3:29 am ] |
| Post subject: | How close are the timing marks. |
In measuring my timing tab/dampener relation ( with my degree wheel ) I found them to be off a bit. I plan to have the dampener reconditioned. Someone on another forum made the comment below though and I would like to know what you guys have noticed with your own dampeners. Have any of you found them too be correct and at zero when measuring them with a degree wheel? One of my balancer is off one degree and the other 3 degrees. ( 2 different engines ) Quote: .......................... One thing to consider is that the balancer hasn't slipped and this is as close as the factory marks will line up. Keep in mind that these marks on the balancer and timing tab are not perfect and being within one or two degrees is as close as the assembly line workers could get them themselves. They use impact wrenches to build these on the assembly line and don't even use torque wrenches either, and the whole engine is assembled in less than 5 minutes. You are spending a lot more time and using a lot more accurate tools than Chrysler did when they put it together. When your truck was new and on the dealership lot, if you picked 10 exact same trucks as yours to check the timing on you would get 10 different readings, they are not all the same, just close enough to fall within the allowed range of acceptable readings. No engines are perfect from the factory, even today with all the high tech manufacturing. And to have your TDC mark be off by a few degrees is actually normal............................................ .................................................. ............. If what is mentioned should be one of my concerns than Im going to assume that there is a good possibility that sending the dampener to damperdudes might only render me a different reading and may not necessarily be the spot on reading I am after. |
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| Author: | SlantSteve [ Tue Jun 24, 2014 3:47 am ] |
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Just remark the balancer if your really concerned when you get it back from being reconditioned.... I've even seen recod balances with no marks on them! Given the tolerances used at the factory I'd say within a few degrees would be pretty normal....the one degree you mentioned would be near perfect in my book...after all,are you sure that your estimation of TDC is soooo accurate? |
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| Author: | 1930 [ Tue Jun 24, 2014 3:49 am ] |
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Quote: Just remark the balancer if your really concerned when you get it back from being reconditioned. Given the tolerances used at the factory I'd say within a few degrees would be pretty normal.
Thanks but at this point I am trying to justify sending it out and paying the 107 dollars to have it reconditioned if its still going to be off from where I feel it should be. At this point I could just re-make a mark myself and be done with it but Id rather had it put back to where I am assuming it should have been in the first place. |
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| Author: | SlantSteve [ Tue Jun 24, 2014 3:57 am ] |
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You don't get a balancer reconditioned to gain an accurate timing mark,you get it reconditioned due to a slipped outer ring or badly deteriorated rubber,if all your worried about is the markings,and the rubber is in good condition,just remark it.....but one degree? I just wouldn't bother. All your going to be using this mark for is ignition timing dedicated to this engine,whether it runs best at 9 degrees or 10 degrees is a moot point....it's really a reference mark to work from . |
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| Author: | WagonsRcool [ Tue Jun 24, 2014 11:08 am ] |
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Maybe your balancer mark is spot on & it's your indicator tab on the timing cover that's off (mass production & all). As Steve put it, don't worry about the balancer if the rubber is in good condition. Use a piston stop to mark your own TDC position on this particular balancer- cover combo & be done with it. |
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| Author: | Reed [ Tue Jun 24, 2014 11:33 am ] |
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Quote: Use a piston stop to mark your own TDC position on this particular balancer- cover combo & be done with it.
+1.
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| Author: | 1930 [ Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:53 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Quote: You don't get a balancer reconditioned to gain an accurate timing mark,you get it reconditioned due to a slipped outer ring or badly deteriorated rubber,if all your worried about is the markings,and the rubber is in good condition,just remark it.....but one degree? I just wouldn't bother. All your going to be using this mark for is ignition timing dedicated to this engine,whether it runs best at 9 degrees or 10 degrees is a moot point....it's really a reference mark to work from .
Thanks Steve, I would not consider getting the balancer that is off by one degree rekoned, I was considering it for the one that had showed the 3 degrees deviation since this is the one I will be using on the engine I am going thru that will be used in my driver. It is a different damper than the one that has only slipped one degree, it is an industrial damper that is original to my engine as far as I know and I want to keep it that way. Condition of rubber is hard to say, its hard and not rubbery for sure but its not oozing out anywhere either. Thanks for the comments |
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| Author: | 1930 [ Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:56 pm ] |
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Quote: Maybe your balancer mark is spot on & it's your indicator tab on the timing cover that's off (mass production & all). As Steve put it, don't worry about the balancer if the rubber is in good condition. Use a piston stop to mark your own TDC position on this particular balancer- cover combo & be done with it.
Good thinking, you are correct, the indicator tab on the 1 degree off engine was bent pretty badly to begin with. I have straightened it but I cannot straighten it enough ( without bending it again ) to make up that one degree. I am not worried about that 1 degree. The 3 degree off damper still has me concerned though |
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| Author: | 1930 [ Tue Jun 24, 2014 2:59 pm ] |
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Quote: Quote: Use a piston stop to mark your own TDC position on this particular balancer- cover combo & be done with it.
+1. |
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| Author: | Reed [ Tue Jun 24, 2014 3:09 pm ] |
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OK, so just make a new timing mark and be done with it. Nothing is precision engineered anymore. Much like buying a "new" or remanufactured carburetor, replacement parts for slant six powered vehicles should always be inspected for proper fit and application and modified as necessary. Or just spend the $107 and cross your fingers that the rebuild shop will put it where you think it should be. |
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| Author: | 1930 [ Tue Jun 24, 2014 3:25 pm ] |
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Quote: OK, so just make a new timing mark and be done with it. Nothing is precision engineered anymore. Much like buying a "new" or remanufactured carburetor, replacement parts for slant six powered vehicles should always be inspected for proper fit and application and modified as necessary.
From the beginning of buying this truck and getting into slants on this forum I have been told over and over again that the dampers slip and I need to check it out. Or just spend the $107 and cross your fingers that the rebuild shop will put it where you think it should be. All this time later I have finally checked it out properly but am still not knowing for sure if 3 degrees is an allowable sloppy tolerance or if the items have indeed slipped. If they have slipped than it will continue to slip which is not something I want so that is why I am trying to find out if there ever was a zero nuts on damper or if 3 degrees aint nuthin to worry about cause alot of them were built that way originally. I will have to inspect the rubber closer I guess and just make a decision cause chances are Im not going to find anyone that worked on these vehicles new and can remember whats what on a damper. Thanks |
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| Author: | sandy in BC [ Tue Jun 24, 2014 3:56 pm ] |
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thing is.....there are many damper / pointer possibilities. If Im mixing and matching I make the pointer I want,,,,,find TDC1 and mark the damper. The condition of the damper at that point is moot. Look at that separately. |
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| Author: | Reed [ Tue Jun 24, 2014 9:09 pm ] |
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Here is the thing- the timing mark may be 3 degrees off from slipping, or it may be three degrees off because that how it was built by Dodge. No matter the reason WHY it is three degrees off, if you use that timing mark to set your timing your timing will be three degrees off. A few years ago I replaced the vibration dampener on my 89 Ford with a new one from Summit racing. I checked and out of the box the timing mark was three degrees off. I agree with Sandy- use the piston stop tool to find true TDC, mark it on the damper, and then run the damper you have. |
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| Author: | nuttyprof [ Wed Jun 25, 2014 6:08 am ] |
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If you get an accurate tdc I'd mark the hub as well, that way if it slips you still have a reference point. |
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| Author: | CNC-Dude [ Wed Jun 25, 2014 3:14 pm ] |
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Once you establish "true TDC" and make the balancer mark match the timing tab, the timing tab becomes the absolute, not the balancer. |
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