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coolant leak...
https://www.slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=57742		 Page 1 of 5
Author:  '67 Dart 270 [ Sat May 23, 2015 5:32 pm ]
Post subject:  coolant leak...
Ugh,....I sealed the studs OK, but I still have a seep somewhere. Likely the water pump. Doesn't seem to be coming from the weep hole. I snugged the bolts a bit more, that seemed to stop. I pressurized the system to 10 psi, and I saw no leaks or drips for an hour.

Then I went off to other matters, my carb ball falling out, worked that out, then there was something in one of the jets. Got that figured out, then I rechecked and there's a few drips of coolant on the K frame...ugh again.

I'm sure I didn't miss any spots when applying sealant to the gaskets, but...

If I can't find it or stop it, I may have to pull the water pump and redo it....double ugh.

brian
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Sat May 23, 2015 5:37 pm ]
Post subject: 
Count yer blessings…the water pump's a whole lot easier to R&R than, say, the oil pan having to be removed because the "Bermuda Triangle" (right front corner) failed to seal.
Author:  Pierre [ Sat May 23, 2015 5:43 pm ]
Post subject: 
Are you sure the coolant on the k-frame wasn't there from before and just hadn't dried? That fooled me more then once before.
Author:  SlantSteve [ Sat May 23, 2015 6:06 pm ]
Post subject: 
Check the by pass hose and heater hose clamps,the surfaces are far from perfectly formed ....obviously the waterless coolant requires more attention to sealing than conventional coolants.
Author:  '67 Dart 270 [ Sat May 23, 2015 6:09 pm ]
Post subject:  it's real...
I meticulously dried everything and watched for leaks when it was pressurized. This is what really bugs me. When it was pressurized, for an hour, the leak was apparently gone. Then I take pressure off the system, feeling confident, and while I'm doing other stuff it's leaking. Granted, more slowly than before, but still...

I can't count on pressure sealing it up, 'cause I'm running Evans and there is no pressure on the system.

I'll drive this way, see if by some miracle it seals up. It's a very slow leak, I'd say after 7 hours I had maybe 5 drips. But, did I mention that I really hate leaks?

Dan, good point. So far, I've not seen any signs of oil leaks, rear seal, timing cover, valve cover, oil pan, nothing so far.

The last time I had a water pump leak was on my 302 cu in (4 bbl, duals, C4 automatic) Mercury Bobcat (Ford Pinto's brother, a real sleeper, no hood scoop, no outward way to tell there was a V8 lurking under the hood). And that was the seal failing, it was leaking from the weep hole. Can't figure where I went wrong on this one, I was very careful when installing the water pump and it appeared to be sealed all the way around.

brian
Author:  nm9stheham [ Sat May 23, 2015 6:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
Check the by pass hose and heater hose clamps,the surfaces are far from perfectly formed ....obviously the waterless coolant requires more attention to sealing than conventional coolants.
I understand (OK, I read) that it is mostly just a mix of glycols, so Evans Waterless is nothing too different from regular AF. Per a somewhat competitive product site:
http://www.norosion.com/evanstest.htm

My thoughts are the same; it could be anywhere up around the pump area; it took a while for me to stop my rebuild from leaking G05 HOAT coolant. Hose clamp re-tightening was the last step to stop the last bit, which followed a couple of heat cycles after a firm snugging up of the pump bolts due to the same kind of pump leaks. I figured the double gasket setup on the pump just offers more opportunities for leaks.
Author:  SlantSteve [ Sat May 23, 2015 7:06 pm ]
Post subject: 
Most times I've been using a very thin smear of silicone on the hose barbs before I slip the hoses on,works well for me! A good quality stainless clamp also helped my woes,some types don't seem to clamp very evenly. It just seems very suspicious with this coolant and leaks,smells,studs leaking,now other areas leaking.there was an older post in here where the user finally switched back to conventional coolants due to problems.The V8 LA engines also has some exhaust stud holes that are thru drilled into water...I run headers and capscrew bolts with a smear of high temp silicone on the gaskets and bolts,never a leak with a standard system...the way my luck runs sometimes if it was going to leak it would be on mine!!

And thankyou for the link.....very interesting :shock:
Author:  SlantSixDan [ Sat May 23, 2015 7:16 pm ]
Post subject: 
There is no difference, obvious or otherwise, in leak properties between Evans and regular coolant.

Pressure doesn't seal up leaks—it makes them worse.

Gluing hoses onto their fittings is one way to reduce the chance of seepage. Fixing the underlying problem causing the seepage is a better way.

I can think of one person who switched back from Evans to regular coolant not because of problems, but because he misunderstood what he thought he was seeing.
Author:  SlantSteve [ Sat May 23, 2015 7:18 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:

Pressure doesn't seal up leaks—it makes them worse.

Gluing hoses onto their fittings is one way to reduce the chance of seepage. Fixing the underlying problem causing the seepage is a better way.
Pressure can seal up a leak at a hose and seals...ie static leaks vs dynamic leak...this is what the OP just stated he had!! Pressurise at 10psi and no leaks,zero pressure and a leak
Quote:
I meticulously dried everything and watched for leaks when it was pressurized. This is what really bugs me. When it was pressurized, for an hour, the leak was apparently gone. Then I take pressure off the system, feeling confident, and while I'm doing other stuff it's leaking. Granted, more slowly than before, but still...

I can't count on pressure sealing it up, 'cause I'm running Evans and there is no pressure on the system.

I'll drive this way, see if by some miracle it seals up. It's a very slow leak, I'd say after 7 hours I had maybe 5 drips. But, did I mention that I really hate leaks?
I'd love to be able to buy a decent water pump casting with well formed hose barbs....but I gave up on that about the same time as I quit believing in the tooth fairy and politicians..if you can find a casting with barbs as smooth as Bambi's backside then you are extremely fortunate on your side of the pond....failing that the sealant works...it's not "glueing up" or whatever you say.
It works for me...no leaks,no puddles of coolant...no hassles.....go on try it ......you know you want to!

https://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/ ... oolant.pdf

This link to Evans own instruction sheets talks about using bars leaks to seal leaks with Evans...also mentions removing thermostats and plugging by pass hoses since they are no longer needed in high performance or warm weather applications... Page 2 then mentions "glueing" up the water pump "weep hole" with silicone... :shock:
Author:  '67 Dart 270 [ Sat May 23, 2015 8:38 pm ]
Post subject:  pressure
Dan, your right in one aspect, pressure in the system can only make a leak worse...but the other person who mentioned heat cycles has a point. There could be some additional sealing when the engine heats up and gets driven, due to the metal expansion, though slight. Maybe it'll seal up for me...

You know that thing sat all night and didn't drip at all, then today it did again.

I took it for a short drive to fill the tank, the engine runs perfectly, no more leaks at the studs and the exhaust is pretty dry, no more drips at the tailpipe and much hotter exhaust. I didn't see any coolant leaks, but I'll see tomorrow after it's cooled down and spent the night in the garage.

I have to get it lined up though, after changing the K-frame and all that under there...didn't pull to either side, but still I could hear a squeak here and there when I hit a turn, not aligned by any means, just roughed in.

Brian
Author:  emsvitil [ Sat May 23, 2015 8:44 pm ]
Post subject: 
If you have some pressure, I've had leaks that would happen on cool down.


With heat, you get expansion and things seal up.

When cooling down, the pressure remains in the system a bit longer than the temperature.

So I would get dribbles until the pressure was gone.



All my leaks like this were at hose connections. Tightening up the screw fixed them..
Author:  '67 Dart 270 [ Sat May 23, 2015 10:39 pm ]
Post subject:  not the hoses...
I checked, and rechecked at all hose connections, they are dry. It seems to be seeping through the water pump gaskets, like they are wicking the fluid through, but only on the driver side. I can't tighten the bolts any further, but the amount that I did slowed it to the current slow seepage.

brian
Author:  '67 Dart 270 [ Sat May 23, 2015 10:39 pm ]
Post subject:  tomorrow
I'll check it tomorrow. It wasn't leaking when I drove it, with the engine warmed up it seemed to seal it, perhaps I'll get lucky..

b
Author:  Pierre [ Sat May 23, 2015 10:56 pm ]
Post subject: 
One of the water pump screws... forget which, but it's one of the lower ones, extends into the coolant cavity. 592 that one?
Author:  '67 Dart 270 [ Sun May 24, 2015 7:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Good point...
...on the water pump bolt that goes into the water jacket, and the leak was in that area...even though I know about that bolt, it never even occurred to me as I labored over the source of the leak. But after I ran it to the gas station and back, about 15 minutes of run time, the leak is apparently gone. No coolant to be seen since last night. Should it creep up again, I'll be sure to pull that bolt and try 592 on it.

I did put my front end up on jack stands and work the steering back and forth to get air out of the steering mechanism today. When it wasn't running, about a half a pint of steering fluid gushed out and all over everything. I cleaned all that up, started it up and worked the steering back and forth some more. Now it's good, no more sluggish steering, air is bled out.

The manifold studs are not leaking, 592 did the job; the exhaust is dry now after warm up. Engine runs great, timing is set. All I need to do now is set the AFR on each bank, get the front end lined up, make sure my kick down is set right.

BTW, as the follow up I promised, here are some pics of how I ran my heater hoses. I used the Dayco "S" shaped hoses to go down and under the alternator, then used hoses with a sharp 90 degree bend for the firewall connection to the core. Now I can pull my valve cover without having to remove or otherwise fight the heater hoses. I pulled it once already to retorque the head bolts.

http://s785.photobucket.com/user/67dart ... ort=3&o=12

http://s785.photobucket.com/user/67dart ... ort=3&o=11

http://s785.photobucket.com/user/67dart ... sort=3&o=3

http://s785.photobucket.com/user/67dart ... sort=3&o=2

http://s785.photobucket.com/user/67dart ... sort=3&o=4

http://s785.photobucket.com/user/67dart ... sort=3&o=5

http://s785.photobucket.com/user/67dart ... sort=3&o=6

Here is how the heater hoses ran before: http://s785.photobucket.com/user/67dart ... rt=3&o=165

And here is how the heater hoses run now: http://s785.photobucket.com/user/67dart ... sort=3&o=1

I used one GM style clip to hold them to the fenderwell, with a bit of tension pulling them back toward the firewall, away from the belts up front.

One more pic of the engine: http://s785.photobucket.com/user/67dart ... sort=3&o=0

I got two Weiand air cleaners to try out, I had to cut the blank base to fit the 32/34 DFT webers. They make bases for other Webers, just not mine.

Brian
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