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| Adventures with /6 Van, and manifold questions... https://www.slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9543 |
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| Author: | Dear Mr. Slantasy [ Fri Jun 11, 2004 2:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Adventures with /6 Van, and manifold questions... |
Okay, let me preface this by saying that the slant six is one of the most willing engines I've ever seen. I have now seen one jump to life, in a stationary vehicle, without the help of the starter! I was trying to get my 1981 Dodge Van inspected, and on the way there the thing died at a busy intersection. The starter cranked like mad, and I pulled the engine shroud off and could smell gas in the carb and the accelerator pump sprayed (meekly), so I pulled the coil wire off and grounded it against the block and cranked the engine and got no spark. Apparently having left the ignition "on," I got out and opened the hood, looking for wiring problems that might have killed my ignition. As I touched the lower ballast resistor connector, the engine suddenly started, causing me to jump a mile. I guess one of the pistons was left at or a little past TDC on the compression stroke, and jiggling the ballast resistor wire caused intermittent voltage that allowed the coil to fire, and everything was lined up just right with that one cylinder that was primed and ready to go, which was enough to send the whole engine spinning. Needless to say, I'm glad the van was in park instead of drive. I took it back home and spent some time making sure terminals were clean and tight, and got back on the road. I failed inspection due to exhaust leaks, which I kind of expected--though that was the only problem they had with it. What I didn't expect was to find no gasket whatsoever between the exhaust manifold and the downpipe. Just metal on metal! I got the gasket, and the engine quieted down some, but I can still hear little "SPUT!"s and can feel searing hot air being blown out near a couple of the points where the exhaust manifold bolts up when I rev the engine. I figure I need to pull the whole mess and put in new gaskets. The van runs a bit rough anyway and I think I should ensure that there are no intake manifold leaks, too, before I start replacing vacuum hoses willy-nilly and rebuilding the carb. Can anyone give me some tips on this process? Some of those nuts look impossible to reach--is there a recommended ratchet extension/adapter combo for reaching those fasteners? Any "gotchas" I need to know about when yanking the mannies? Is there a preferred order of steps? Preferred brand of gasket? I have several aftermarket service books, but in my experience these things sometimes don't tell you the easiest way, or gloss over the fact that if you don't do "step 3" a certain way, you'll botch the whole thing or spend hours trying to figure it out. So any expertise is greatly appreciated. This would probably be an ideal time to put a super six kit in the van, but I just don't have the bread for it. But I'm sure the ordeal will make it easier when I do get around to it sometime. Luckily, I bought the van for camping and as a sort of "parking lot storage unit" and have alternate transportation while I mess with this. Thanks in advance for the help, y'all. D. Mr. S. |
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| Author: | DusterIdiot [ Fri Jun 11, 2004 2:46 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Kinda did this recently... |
some 'tips'... Get your 'gaskets' in a 'row' before pulling things apart... I highly recommend the Mr.Gasket #320/#320G to make sure you get the 'stack' sealed up really good. There is an awesome article off the .org home page that can show you some things to look for/ stuff to goop. If you're going full bore, you'll also want an intake/ exhaust metal shim gasket (where the two manifolds mate/ heat stove)... And so far one of our member's recommended a late-70's early 80's V-8 Ford Van gasket for the exhuast pipe to manifold connection...this double thick gasket works great if you have the 'larger' exhaust pipe (i.e. 2.25"+). Once you have the 'stuff' (gaskets and sealant). I'd soak the living pucky out of the bolts/nuts you're going to loosen with some 'liquid wrench' (some guys use PB Blaster, others have better suggestions) soak them good for a few hours, or soak them every couple hours for a day (let it get in there 'good'). Sounds like you'll need some extensions and ''wobblies" to get to where you're going, you may also want to have a set of 1/4" sockets and extensions handy as some bolts are hard to reach with a 3/8" extension and socket... someone else will chime in with some other advice, but that's enough to get your gray matter rolling in the right direction.... -D.Idiot |
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| Author: | Dear Mr. Slantasy [ Fri Jun 11, 2004 3:14 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Hey, thanks for the input. I think I found the article you mean. This gasket that apparently lies between the manifolds where the heat riser....what's going on with that? Is this a sort of dead-air space in between the manifolds that gets heated up by the exhaust manifold? Or is this area actually open to the exhaust passages and a possible source of further exhaust leaks? I live in a pretty hot climate. I wonder if it would be easier to just get a header. |
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| Author: | Guest [ Fri Jun 11, 2004 3:20 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Wait...okay, I can see in the pictures that the heat riser is apparently open to the exhaust passages. Interesting...never seen anything like that. |
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| Author: | sputnik71 [ Fri Jun 11, 2004 3:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | manifold hardware |
Hi, I'm about to go thru the same thing on m '80 stepside 4-spd. I'm having a difficult time finding studs, washers, nuts, etc. for replacing the old rusty,- "I swear I'll snap if you try to torque me", hardware. Any suggestions anyone can throw my way? Hey Guest, I know your pain, although, luckily, I don't have an inspection to worry about!! Thanks guys. Sputnik |
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| Author: | DusterIdiot [ Fri Jun 11, 2004 8:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Hardware Wars... |
Last time I replaced studs, I hit a local mom and pop auto parts store that had a 'wall' of Dorman products (plugs, studs, etc..) and they had the studs I needed in a drawer (about $3.50 worth)... The 'problem' children are the studs and bolts that hold the two manifolds together. Luckily with some liberal use of the PB Blaster the middle retaining 'stud' has always stayed put, but the two outer bolts have broken. currently on my '74 with a super six manifold, I replaced those long threaded bolts with some 5/16" 'all thread' from a nuts and bolts store (I used a type called D-8, which is better than a grade 8 bolt), and torqued it down with nuts on both ends (yes, I used anti-seize so I can get them off again if needed later...) hope that helps a bit... -D.Idiot |
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| Author: | Doctor Dodge [ Sat Jun 12, 2004 7:30 am ] |
| Post subject: | |
A link to the manifold install article: DD http://www.slantsix.org/articles/manifo ... unting.htm |
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| Author: | Dear Mr. Slantasy [ Sun Jun 13, 2004 2:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | |
Whew. Well past the point of no return now. Got the manifolds off the engine and separated. They seem pretty straight and uncracked. The gasket was thoroughly blown in the spot where I was feeling hot air leaking out, but seemed intact most everywhere else. Hopefully this was the only problem area. Several of the mounting studs (basically everything forward of the centermost stud) came out as "bolts"--essentially the studs backed out of head rather than give up the nuts. This is where I discovered that some of these studs apparently intrude upon coolant passages. Hello, mess! Took me a while to clean that up, but at least none of the neighborhood pets are in danger. Unfortunately, the two "driver's side" bolts holding the manifolds together both broke off flush in the exhaust manifold despite a whole lot of penetrating oil and soaking time. Not sure what to do here...of course, the other stud, the one closest to the head, looks like a gnarled old tree at its base, and the nut came off with virtually no torque, so that's certainly in need of replacement. I just know it will break when I torque it if I don't and I'll have to start all over again. Questions: 1. Any thoughts on getting the broken studs out of the exhaust manifold? I can see both ends of them, and I know better than to try an EZ-out on anything so firmly siezed. Think I could just drill those guys out? Is this something a machine shop will typically do? 2. I figure if some of the studs came out of the head, it would probably be best to replace them with new ones. However, I'm not sure how one goes about putting studs in. Do you just wind two nuts together on the opposite end and use that as a "bolt head" to install the stud? What kind of torque should I put on the stud? 10-15 ft-lbs, as suggested in Doc's article for the nuts holding the manifolds? Or is this a different ball of wax? Should I loc-tite them? 3. My neighborhood hardware store seems to have plenty of studs on hand, and grade 8 nuts and bolts. Some of those lower manifold nuts were absolute murder to get to in taking them off, so I can only imagine what fun it will be to get them back on. If it turns out to be easier, is there any reason I couldn't get away with using grade 8 bolts instead of studs in some of these locations, specifically the intermediate ones with the butterfly washers? Sorry about the barrage of questions, but I really appreciate the help. Thanks, D. Mr. S. |
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