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run outta ideas and still in trouble
https://www.slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9989		 Page 1 of 3
Author:  argentina-slantsixer [ Sun Aug 01, 2004 1:41 am ]
Post subject:  run outta ideas and still in trouble
Hey guys

I have my freshly rebuilt slant with my freshly rebuilt 904 and dana 44 3.07:1 rear.

The car runs fine, I've been trying things such as improved carburetion, improved distribution, I have mild cam, hooker headers, dual ex, hardened valvle seats, shaved head and block, steel head gasket, blah blah.

the issue I have is that after a while at cruising speed of, let's say, 60 mph, when I stop, i.e. to get outta the higway or to pay toll, the engine is "nervous" and stalls. After restarting the thing it would be rough idling and so till I let it cool down for a while. I'm not getting temp issues, my cooling sys is fine... the only thing I'm suspicious about is thet when I pop the radiator cap I'm not getting ANY pressure neiter boiling or whatever. It just seems to be as cool as it can be... or maybe I have a stucked thermo? over 65-70 mph is pinging like hell.

If I use the car at town driving speed, slowly, and whitout getting too excited about leaving all the japanese crap behind, the car runs fine and I get no stalling or rough idling.

So far, I have tweaked my carb to run on the lean side, on the rich side, high idling, low idling, I changed 3 dists, I tried diff'rent vac pods, etc etc.
I've setted valvle lash 3 times from .5 to .22 and ain't seems to get better. Now I have a .7 admission and .11 ex valvle lash setup.

anyone can help me? :cry:
Author:  64 Convert [ Sun Aug 01, 2004 6:28 am ]
Post subject: 
I would suspect vapor lock for the rough idle after a highway run. You might try re-routing your fuel line, if it now runs anywhere near the exhaust system.

As for the pinging issue, I can't even offer a suggestion, other than it obviously sounds like you are getting too much advance at higher RPM's. Since you've changed everything, that seems odd.
Author:  Reed [ Sun Aug 01, 2004 9:03 am ]
Post subject: 
Argentina slant sixer- What ignition system are you running? Did you install a remanufactured distributor or did you use your original?

The reason I ask is I have been having similar problems with my 1984 Ford Van. Freshly rebuilt motor and transmission, pinging at high speeds and on acceleration and sometime a rough stumbling idle. I have fiddled with the cabr and timing and the conclusion I have come to is that the remanufactured distributor I installed when I rebuilt the motor has a vacuum advance pod that provides too much advance and the springs on the mechanical advance may be too light. Unfortunately I gave my original distributor to the parts store as a "core" (D'OH!). Anyway, you may need to start fine tuning the advance curve in your distributor if you aren't using the original.

Reed
Author:  Dennis Weaver [ Sun Aug 01, 2004 9:33 am ]
Post subject: 
Sounds like a vacuum leak to me. First, disconnect and plug, one by one, all vacuum hoses and connections and see if any of them have an effect. If no, then get a bootle of unlit propane and shoot it around the carb base and various intake junctures when it is idling crappy and see if it picks up or smooths out. Could be something up with the carb, too.

I suppose it could be a fuel supply problem, too, as stated above. What kinda shape is your fuel pump in? How hot does your carb get after cruise?

Your lash sounds a bit tight, by the way.

D/W
Author:  MitchB [ Sun Aug 01, 2004 9:43 am ]
Post subject: 
Don't continue to run it if you are pinging. If you have a vacuum distributor, disconnect & plug the vacuum line to the distributor advance. Does this eliminate the ping?

Mitch
Author:  argentina-slantsixer [ Sun Aug 01, 2004 3:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Thanks Thanks Thanks
Thank you guys...

let's take a look at what I've done so far...

By the way dennis, my carb's a holley :lol: so air leak ain't a possibility to overlook :)

I've been using 3 dists (all of them electronic):
stock one that had a R11.5 govnor and 4 vac pod
new repro unit, I don't know how much govnor and R8.5 vac pod
modified to R9 govnor, and 2.5 vac pod, 4 vac pod, 8.5 vac pod

since I don't have my TDC tag installed on the timing cover (D'OH! i forgot to install it when I put together the engine) I don't know how much initial timing I have. Now I'm kinda wondering if I don't have toooo much overall advance (even with the modified dist)

I'm running a mopar electronic ignition. My air gap between pickup and reluctor is .08 on the three dists, gaped with mopar brass gauges, and I checked all the 6 tooths in search of bent dist shafts. No bent, no play at all.

my carb's a holley 1922 model (I've posted some pix recently) now I'm running a stock one, matching #'s with original specs for my car (but it ain't a bone stock engine so maybe.... hmmmm) But now I'm thinking that I removed the original auto choke controls (went to manual) and I closed the vac line for the vac choke limiter... that thingy "drinks" from the same duct as dist does so maybe I'm getting too much vacuum on the dist line ??

gas pump is a stock new unit, It pumps fine.

I'm thinking of:
A) gettin the fuel line rerouted over the valvle cover
B) put a carb spacer to see if I can cool the thing down
C) explore the PCV breathers (I have one hose connected to carb's base and the other from the oil cap to the air cleaner housing) and see if after a long run it kinda stucks open or closed or whatever. I'd try a fixed gap, say like 3/16" hole always open at the PCV valve to see what happens
D) get an axe :twisted: and yank the damned think in 1/8" pieces :wink:
E) install one of those units that separates fuel gases from fresh fuel, actually the car had one of those installed before I rebuilted the engine. I routed a new line that currently not in use but is there.

And I've been trying to cool down my own head 8) since I can't think when I'm frustrated with this kind of behavior (my ride's behavior, huh?)

I appreciate your comments and still wanna hear more... so when I'm ready to work I'll have your insights ligthin me up or correcting some of my ideas or just confirming some of my guesses and I'd feel a lot more solid in what I'm doin.

I really appreciate you guys... where else I can have this nice "conversation" on sunday? To give you an example of how most of the dodge guys are down here, I can tell you this: the other day one fellow told me "all of that things are the auto trans and the electronic ignition. Chop them off and it'll work fine" :x dumba** or what?
Author:  Dennis Weaver [ Sun Aug 01, 2004 7:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Thanks Thanks Thanks
Quote:
By the way dennis, my carb's a holley :lol: so air leak ain't a possibility to overlook :)
Sorry, I don't get it... :? :)

D/W
Author:  argentina-slantsixer [ Sun Aug 01, 2004 8:09 pm ]
Post subject: 
mean vacuum leak :) as you said
Author:  Reed [ Sun Aug 01, 2004 9:58 pm ]
Post subject: 
(1) You say you have you distributor advance line plumbed into the same port as your choke pulloff. THis is incorrect. The choke pulloff vacuum port will be a constant vacuum port. The distributor advance should be connected to a "ported" vacuum source--one that has vacuum only when the throttle is opened.

(2) Put your timing indicator tab back on your engine before you try anything else. You cannot properly diagnose an engine without knwoing where the timing is set.
Author:  Dennis Weaver [ Mon Aug 02, 2004 8:26 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
(1) You say you have you distributor advance line plumbed into the same port as your choke pulloff. THis is incorrect. The choke pulloff vacuum port will be a constant vacuum port. The distributor advance should be connected to a "ported" vacuum source--one that has vacuum only when the throttle is opened.

(2) Put your timing indicator tab back on your engine before you try anything else. You cannot properly diagnose an engine without knwoing where the timing is set.
Good points, all :)

D/W
Author:  Jeb [ Mon Aug 02, 2004 9:59 am ]
Post subject: 
The vacum advance line on my Duster hooks to the intake manifold. Is it hooked up to the correct spot? OR is it supposed to hook on the Carb somewhere.
Author:  argentina-slantsixer [ Mon Aug 02, 2004 11:07 am ]
Post subject: 
ain't "THE SAME" port. I'm a jackass :oops: . The choke pulloff shared its main well at the base of the carb with the economy valvle.

vac line is ported, and I know you gonna answer to Jeb that never should be connected to the intake manifold. 8)

OK i'm gonna try to put that tab back again, if I don't have to pull off the harmonic balancer to do so. :wink: If not, I may wait till I blow the thing away trying new stuff :twisted:
Author:  Slant6Ram [ Mon Aug 02, 2004 1:25 pm ]
Post subject:  get the tool
The tool for removing and installing a harmonic balancer is only $20-$25. It's not a bad investment since you'll never wear it out.

Make it easy on yourself. IMHO.
Author:  argentina-slantsixer [ Mon Aug 02, 2004 1:59 pm ]
Post subject: 
where I can get one online there? I can't find the correct thread down here... I was thinking about get one tool I saw at compcams, it's a whole set puller/installer with diffrent threads...

thanx
Juan
Author:  Jeb [ Mon Aug 02, 2004 3:37 pm ]
Post subject: 
There is a fitting on the base of my carb with a vacum plug on it. Is that where the hose is supposed to go? Since it is hooked to the intake manifold, is it getting too much vacum? It has no pinging problems, just sluggish in 2 gear.
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