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 Post subject: Which oil pump
PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 10:23 am 
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3 Deuce Weber
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Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2008 1:05 pm
Posts: 94
Location: Moreno Valley,CA
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Recently my oil light started coming on at idle and would go off just after 1000 rpms. I have a chrome valve cover with no baffles so I pulled the breather and looked at the rocker arm when running and almost no oil was flowing. I ran up the rpms and got some oil but very little. I'm guessing it's the pump and my question is what brand would be best for my 73 225?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 10:50 am 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 13265
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model: 76 D100
Before I replaced the pump (especially in an a body), I would first put on a good oil filter (Fleetguard or Purolator Pure One), the right weight oil (5W-30), and, if no oil is reaching the rockers, verify that the rocker arm shaft is oriented properly.

Next, I would try cleaning the oil pump pressure relief valve. I believe this can be done leaving the pump on the block. Only after all those things had been done would I change the oil pump.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 12:35 pm 
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3 Deuce Weber
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Location: Moreno Valley,CA
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I did change the oil filter and no difference. The rocker shaft has not been touched. I'll check the pressure relief valve when I get a chance. Thanks for the tip.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 4:42 pm 
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3 Deuce Weber
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Location: Moreno Valley,CA
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Thanks Reed,

It was no problem taking out the prv, it was a little gunky so I cleaned it real good and put it back in and so far the oil light does not come on at idle. It still looks like the one rocker I can see through the hole in the valve cover is not getting enough oil at idle. I think I'll pull the valve cover and see if all the rockers are oiling the same. Another question I have adjusted the valves before and noticed that it looks like old oil is caked on basically everything is there some type of cleaner I can add to the oil to clean the system and then change the oil?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 5:11 pm 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 9:20 pm
Posts: 13265
Location: Fircrest, WA
Car Model: 76 D100
The best way to clean an oiling system long term is to run the correct temperature thermostat and good oil and take the car for several long highway drives were the engine gets good and hot.

You can try replacing one quart of oil with transmission fluid and run it for 100 miles or so and then change the oil and filter.

Alternatively, you can run some marvel mystery oil with your next oil change. That has some detergents in it, too.

You can also remove the rocker shaft and rocker arms and try soaking them in Kroil or some other penetrating lubricant overnight and then scrubbing them and getting into the passages with wires and pipe cleaners. Rocker arm shafts are hard to clean. Try shooting a penetrating lubricant through the oiling passage on each rocker arm.

If you want to try and do a full engine interior de-gunk, you can try SlantSixDan's method:
Quote:
Careful-careful-careful. Those "engine flush" compounds you can find at the auto parts store can do a tremendous amount of damage.

I have long maintained that your engine is not a toilet (Chevrolet Vega, Cadillac HT4100 and V8-6-4, and Ford 3.0 owners excepted) and therefore does not need flushing except under specific and rare conditions as a corrective measure. Everyone's got a pet theory on how best to flush a crudded-up engine without pulling the pan. Some methods are harmless but ineffective. Some methods are potentially harmful. Some methods are harmless and effective. For best results, pick one of that last kind.

I do not believe there is any such thing as a safe, effective and fast engine flush procedure. You can pick any two of these three: Safe and effective (but not fast), safe and fast (but not effective), effective and fast (but not safe). The risks fall into two categories:
Softening/damaging engine gaskets and seals so they don't seal well any more
Sweeping large amounts of dirt and crud from its resting place into the oil filter, which plugs and goes into bypass mode, sending the cräp directly to the bearings and quickly failing the engine. I watched this happen to a Chev 305 once. It was quite a spectacle.


Those "5-minute engine flush" compounds mostly contain Butyl Cellosolve,
which is a specialized solvent that's very good at one particular task: Cleaning the mayonnaise out of a crankcase that's had coolant in it due to a faulty head (etc.) gasket. Their use in any other situation is risky.

My own engine flush recipe is a delicious blend of Marvel Mystery Oil (very light weight and good at dissolving gums and sludges), Kroil (best penetrant on the planet), ATF (detergent/dispersant with good lubricity), and Berryman B12 ChemTool (good at dissolving crud too tough for Marvel Mystery Oil). My procedure involves warming up the engine, draining the oil, changing the oil filter, replacing the drain plug (!), and pouring in the soup. For a 5-quart crankcase, I usually start with 1/1/2/1 (Marvel/Kroil/ATF/B12). Then start and run the engine in the driveway at around 1200 to 1700 RPM with no sudden acceleration and no load applied, for 15 minutes.

Shut down, drain (really let it drain, walk away for 45 minutes), change the filter again, repeat with new soup for 30 to 45 minutes depending how gross the first batch of soup was when it was drained and how quickly the second batch of soup cruds up. Check the dipstick periodically.

If the 2nd batch of soup comes out coalmine black and full of chunks, run in another batch of soup (and another new filter!) and repeat until chips, chunks and tar stop coming out when you drain it.

You'll note the filter is replaced before any attempt is made to introduce a flushing agent into the crankcase, and the filter is replaced again every time you drain a batch of flushing soup. Without doing this, you run the very real risk of inundating the filter, which will go into bypass mode and send all the loosened-up crud directly to the bearings and other critical parts: Goodbye, engine, it was nice gnawing you.

I've gotten amazing amounts of corruption and trash out of engines using this recipe and method. Other methods and other recipes may work better
for other people with other cars. And as always, be advised that if the engine is really tired and whipped, even a safe flush can cause additional problems in the form of "new" leaks.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 7:21 pm 
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Turbo Slant 6

Joined: Sun Jun 01, 2014 10:27 am
Posts: 548
Location: Waynesboro VA
Car Model:
My /6 acquired last year was gunked like that (probably worse). I did some cleaning with high detergent oils, multiple oil and filter changes and such, but it really did not touch the gunk in the head where I could see it. Ended up re-building the engines for a variety of reasons, and found about 1.5-2 cups of crud in the pan, and the oil pickup about 90% blocked with crud and varnish. I did not try the advertised 'soup' but if I had, I would have had a QUART of crud from the engine, based on what we found at teardown.

Bottom line is if you really have a lot of visible crud, you need a way get the possible large wads of crud out that may result from a good cleaning. Dropping the pan is almost a requirement in my opinion, based on what we found. What we did get out (prior to the rebuild) was so much that it slumped forward under hard braking down a steep hill and caused the oil light to come on by blocking the pickup for a moment!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 8:34 pm 
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3 Deuce Weber
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Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2008 1:05 pm
Posts: 94
Location: Moreno Valley,CA
Car Model:
Well I'm about due for a oil change so maybe I'll try the trans fluid method.
It's not that there's a lot of crud it just could use some cleaning out.

I bought the car from a guy that got it from a estate sale and he only had it for 6 months before I got it. It's my daily driver for work 1 1/2 miles each way and just around town. I guess I need to start taking a long drive a couple times a month.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 9:28 pm 
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TBI Slant 6
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Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2013 3:39 pm
Posts: 210
Location: Houston, TX
Car Model:
Please use a good oil filter. I had the same low oil pressure problem, and after using 10W-30 oil, and a Wix filter the gauge is indicating 30 psi at idle, when before was barely 10 psi. Unfortunately Wix might have gone the chinese way: see

http://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php ... r&start=15

So better buy Slant6Dan reccomended brand, Fleetguard.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2015 5:48 am 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2008 1:25 pm
Posts: 5612
Location: Downeast Maine
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Quote:
I bought the car from a guy that got it from a estate sale and he only had it for 6 months before I got it. It's my daily driver for work 1 1/2 miles each way and just around town.
That driving pattern is problematic as the engine never warms to full operating temperature which causes sludge build up from unevaporated moisture in sump, as well as never drying out exhaust causing it to rot off in a few years. Also the engine never comes of choke providing an environment for combustion chamber deposit formation.

Rx for your DD is to take it out for nonstop 50 mile drive once a week to dry it out. Perhaps a 190-195 degree thermostat will help for the dry-out ride.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2015 8:57 am 
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3 Deuce Weber
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Joined: Sun Feb 03, 2008 1:05 pm
Posts: 94
Location: Moreno Valley,CA
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Ok last question (yea right) am I to use the short or tall oil filter and can someone give me a # for the fleetguard? Thanks for everybodys input and info.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2015 4:11 pm 
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TBI Slant 6
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Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2013 3:39 pm
Posts: 210
Location: Houston, TX
Car Model:
C'mon! Use the search button (2 buttons to the left of the logout one), really useful!. Just used it, found this

http://slantsix.org/forum/viewtopic.php ... ard#357905

The number is there, given by Dan...

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 Post subject: older link..
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2015 8:53 pm 
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Turbo EFI
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Joined: Wed Nov 23, 2011 11:07 am
Posts: 2132
Location: SF Bay Area
Car Model: 67 dart 2 door hardtop
Yes, but Fleetguard's current cross reference for the wix 1806 is LF701 (with standpipe).

b

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 27, 2015 11:29 pm 
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TBI Slant 6
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Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2013 3:39 pm
Posts: 210
Location: Houston, TX
Car Model:
Well, Im using the Wix 51515, so no standpipe for me. Probably is even better if you get the one with the standpipe, but I guess the low pressure drop through the filter is the most important thing now...

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2015 12:51 am 
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EFI Slant 6
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Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2015 12:40 am
Posts: 351
Location: Castle Rock
Car Model:
My problem is that where I put the filter relocater, I cant run a tall filter. Anyone know the cross reference number for fleetguard when using a wix 51085?

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2015 4:31 am 
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Supercharged
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Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2008 1:25 pm
Posts: 5612
Location: Downeast Maine
Car Model:
Oil Filter cross match.

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07' 300 C AWD; Now by Fiat, the old new Chrysler LLC

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