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 Post subject: Engine rebuild
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 5:56 pm 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''

Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2011 8:32 pm
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 Post subject: It's...
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 7:50 pm 
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Joined: Tue Oct 29, 2002 8:27 pm
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Location: Salem, OR
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Quote:
I'm using a fel-pro gasket set for the rebuild and have not measured the gasket yet so I have no idea where it will be at till I get the set.
Measuring the gasket will not get you the proper 'squish' height... that will happen after being torqued... That being said... Fel-pro will give a you range of how much it will compress depending on how much you torque it down... typically it can be from .036 to .043... I typically split the difference at .039 for calculating purposes...end results will vary depending on how aggressively you torque it and if you later decide to try and retorque it...

Others will have to weigh in on the turbo mods, but your list looks sound from building the block up for a mild turbo setup... Unless it's been abused I have yet to see a slant six crank be out of round more than .001 on it's rod journals... so you might be OK there. Don't forget that if you have an automatic with the 1966 torque convertor, you need the annular spacer to fit the early convertor nose in the 1968+ crank....

Quote:
I have a friend that will CC the head for me and help me even out the differences if they are really bad on the head
I have 3 O/S valve peanut plug heads... and one thing I have noticed compared to the range of the 60's heads is that the combustion chambers in the 1975-1978 heads are very consistent (and unless someone ran the mix way too lean too long...an unshaved head typically starts at 53-54cc for the chamber right off the bat, so be careful it won't take too much milling to reduce the chamber quickly in size...)

One thing you can do is get the block machined, then install the head before the pistons are installed and trace the bore on the head...pull the head and grind/ relieve the valve radius shrouded by the wall of the combustion chamber, then have a clean up cut done on the head surface to true it up and clean up any grinding leftovers.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 8:31 pm 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''

Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2011 8:32 pm
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Thanks for the info DusterIdiot.
is there a site that I can plug in numbers to see what the compression might be after I do all the mods? I'll start with .039 as a general guide of squish.

I am also re-using the 68 or 78 trans to match the block that I will be using (after I get done rebuilding it) it'll be my first 904 since I've done 3 727s that have not broke yet. (between the books and the videos I was able to do the first one with only 1 oops , forgot a gasket on the tail shaft) I've watched the videos a couple of times already and got the book for the 904 so we'll see how it goes. I am looking at upgraded parts though and don't have any ideas on what or where to get the better parts for the trans.

I will assemble the head to block without the pistons and check if I have to open it up or at least how much anyway.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2016 6:32 am 
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Turbo EFI

Joined: Tue May 17, 2005 4:26 pm
Posts: 1237
Location: CBS Newfoundland Canada
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I don`t have much experience with turbo`s but don`t forget increased piston clearance and ring end gap. I found stock cast seal power piston .005 side clearance and .022 ring gap worked for me up too 14psi boost.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 9:11 am 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 11:49 am 
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Turbo EFI

Joined: Tue May 17, 2005 4:26 pm
Posts: 1237
Location: CBS Newfoundland Canada
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9 to 1 is not bad but you have to be real careful of total timing, fuel richness and fuel octane. I like the results I am seeing from methanol injection.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 1:11 pm 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''

Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2011 8:32 pm
Posts: 27
Car Model:
Quote:
9 to 1 is not bad but you have to be real careful of total timing, fuel richness and fuel octane. I like the results I am seeing from methanol injection.
Ahh ya gotta remember I'm just using it as a daily comfort cruiser that has an added power level. my goal is a convertible cruiser for longer trips with enough power to get out of it's own way (the turbo for above 2-3k rev's so I CAN pass)that does not mean I'm not going to put my foot into the pedal as much as I can and more than is good for me, ahh and a good idle for my A/C.
The 9.01 block was bone stock internal except for the compression changes ran fine from takeoff to about 55 and just didn't have highway performance to pass comfortably using 390cfm 4bbl. dual (User named waggin over on forabodiesonly custom made duals)exhaust 2.5", plus it didn't help with 3.55 gearing.
I will be going to megasquirtII with EFI along with all the other work. I figure it'll be worth the added cost to make it more modern along with comfortable. I'm thinking new injectors around the same as a jeep 4.0 size 25 or 36lbs/hr rating ev6 design,


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 5:37 pm 
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Turbo EFI

Joined: Tue May 17, 2005 4:26 pm
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Location: CBS Newfoundland Canada
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sounds good, 8)


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 3:33 pm 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''

Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2011 8:32 pm
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And discovered that #1 piston pin has to be pressed in a bit more for me to feel safe putting it in the bore

but here are the specs
30 bore
10/10 on the crank
Head has larger valves and shaved .040
#819 Oregon Cam grind.
new lifters
I'll mock up the pistons so I can see how far in the bore they are and deck the block if needed. I'll keep the compression low enough for the turbo upgrade. using the calculator with the original pistons being .097 in the hole I came up with 8.0 compression When looking at the turbo forums and on here I'm leaning towards the light side(8.3 to 8.5) instead of my desired 9 to 1 compression since I am going turbo.
I'm will be adding turbo after I get it broke in on the engine stand and about 1k in the car to make sure I have things working right before I go into the new to me unexplored "turbo area"

Do I need to make the ring gap larger (and the top 1 or both rings?) and how much for 8-10lb boost max? .005 enough? I know I did about .008 when I supercharged my 440 but that was years ago and thing might/did change so I want to get some info on the turbo setups and changes needed to help me survive with this engine.


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 Post subject: Make sure...
PostPosted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 3:54 pm 
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Joined: Tue Oct 29, 2002 8:27 pm
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Location: Salem, OR
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Quote:
Head has larger valves and shaved .040

This doesn't mean much yet, until you get a large syringe and piece of home depot plastic with a couple of 1/8" or so holes drilled in it, to measure the chamber volume... you will need to install the spark plug you intend to use to get the true volume of the chamber, then you will be able to see where your static compression ratio will lie...

If you used a late head (1974+), they are typically 54 cc stock, .040 cut is going to take 6 cc out of the volume... depending on how the new valves sit, this could be another few CC....

FYI.


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 Post subject: Re: Make sure...
PostPosted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 6:46 pm 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''

Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2011 8:32 pm
Posts: 27
Car Model:
Quote:
Quote:
Head has larger valves and shaved .040

This doesn't mean much yet, until you get a large syringe and piece of home depot plastic with a couple of 1/8" or so holes drilled in it, to measure the chamber volume... you will need to install the spark plug you intend to use to get the true volume of the chamber, then you will be able to see where your static compression ratio will lie...

If you used a late head (1974+), they are typically 54 cc stock, .040 cut is going to take 6 cc out of the volume... depending on how the new valves sit, this could be another few CC....

FYI.
Thanks
I have some 100cc syringes on hand(can't justify a glass styrette yet) and can get the redone head and measured . before it was done I got 57CC on the deepest one and 55cc on 3 others the other 2 came in somewhere in between. I'm hoping it came down a bit after surfacing the head and adding new valves.


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 Post subject: Yep...
PostPosted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 7:08 pm 
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Joined: Tue Oct 29, 2002 8:27 pm
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Location: Salem, OR
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Quote:
(can't justify a glass styrette yet)
Not really needed for this application... would be more prudent if we had closed heads and pop up pistons and every 0.1 cc counted...


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 2:16 pm 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''

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Dang I might have ordered the wrong bearings for my slant.
It looks like I have a cast crank(thin parting line instead of the really thicker one.) instead of a forged crank in my block. (probably sent the wrong one to the shop so the issue is on me) but the block had the cranks in it so they both match anyway. I just wish I'd have checked close when they loaded the block and crank up on the trailer..

the block numbers on the deck are 8 W 225 6079 and the casting numbers on the block below the manifold side are 530-7 (casting rib in between the numbers) and 0398: under the red paint it was turquoise (sp) so instead of me thinking I have a 68 it just might be a later model year. anyone have an Idea about the year of this block?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 3:04 pm 
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Turbo EFI

Joined: Sat Feb 20, 2010 10:23 am
Posts: 1343
Location: N. Ga.
Car Model: 64 Valiant
Rod bearings are different too in case you already have those also!

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 7:58 pm 
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4 BBL ''Hyper-Pak''

Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2011 8:32 pm
Posts: 27
Car Model:
Quote:
Rod bearings are different too in case you already have those also!
yeah, I got it all gaskets oil pump,rods,mains cam bearings, timing chain and gears . Now I will have to look up my timing chain and gears too. #$%#$%
the good thing is I do have a 68 engine that I'm working on getting ready for the same rebuild.


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